FPS instant drop in games

[Pinchy]

Hello everyone,

Don't know what is wrong with my computer. Here is the story:

I recently upgraded my graphics card to an X800 PRO ViVo and flashed it to an XT PE from onboard graphics. As i was playing Counter Strike: Source, after 2 to 5 minutes my frames would drop dramatically, from over 100 FPS to 10-20 FPS. It would drop faster when i add bots. I then thought it was a cooling issue so i bought an Arctic cooler. This slightly fixed the problem, but still after 10-25 minutes it would happen. I then took apart my CPU cooler and noticed that the heatsink had a layer of dust on it. I vaccumed it out and it ran perfectly...no frame drop. It has been 3 days since then and now as i play it doesnt drop dramatically, but it still happens. I am playing online, on a Game Arena server with 16 on 16 and getting 50-60 FPS, but after an hour or so of play, it just drops to 10-15, which is non-stop lag.

My temps do not get very hot. In ATI Tools 3D view, my GPU will hit like 50-52*C (from the 70-75 w/ stock cooler) my CPU will hit 45-50*C (from the 66-70 it was hitting with all the dust)

Computer specs are <-------

Any and all help is greatly appreciated :)

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[mmx]

it may be a program running in background, such a antivirus, defragmenter, virus, spyware...

[Pinchy]

All i run in the background is Trend Micro PC Cillin Internet Security 2006 out of those. But why woukd it just drop INSTANTLY if it was a program that was doing it?

Also, i just did the ATi tool 3D view and noticed that the CPU didnt get over 35*C and GPU didnt go over 50.

Thanks for the quick reply.

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[mmx]

observe while playing and frame drops if there is intens hard disk activity,
Try to run 3dmark05 in a loop (only the game tests) for 1hour, and see is there are frame drops then tell us how it was....

[ataraxia]

virus scanning will use about 30-60 percent (if not more) of your particular cpu which means your gaming app and antivirus will be fighting for your cpu. most virus programs are really useless...unless used right. to have them running from start up is pretty much useless. basically most virus programs are only good if you scan files downloaded first before executing them. letting most run in the background thinking you are protected is wrong. the fact is most people download a infected file (without knowing), execute it and the virus is now on the computer. well now you have a chance your antivirus wont delete the virus or it just might. where if you scanned it before you executed you could just delete the file without any hitch. so basically if your a gamer i would a) turn off the antivirus while playing or b)go to the scheduled scanning option and make it for a time your comp will be on but you wont be gaming. or c)turn it off in the system configuration utility "startup".

you want to turn as off as many programs in the background as you can while gaming. you risk updates going on which kills your ping and programs starting up to scan or just running in the background using resources. in windows task manager i try to keep my gaming machine processes around 19-25. with this i notice that my cpu normally will jump around peaking at 5%.

again this may or may not be your problem solver but i can reassure you that running a antivirus while gaming is worthless and a resource hog.

[Pinchy]

Yeah, generally i actually exit my Trend Micro (my anti-virus and firewall) before i play games because the firewall gets in the way and gets very annoying.

[mikechinym]

me too.the pc i use for gaming didnt install any antivirus software inside:)

[Yik]

Yeah I personally end all uneeded processes before joining a game, usually cut to about ~18. Try to disable to completely then trying again, see if it fixes your lag problems.

[trog100]

loop the 3dmark that takes online things out of the equation.. see if u still get the fps drops..

dropping from 100 to 20 is a big drop.. i cant think of anything running in the background that would cause that.. even another game.. he he..

but run some none online tests..

trog

[Ketxxx]

try updating your mainboard bios and clearing your cmos. sounds like a bios bug. had similar probs before. orif that fails you can try a different VC bios file, some are more compatible than others. finally, you could well just have a minor defect in the gpu which is enough to hamper it in this way. you did pay for a Pro after all, not a XT PE ;)

[Azn Tr14dZ]

^True, something could've happened when you flashed it. Did the framrate drop like this when it was still a Pro ViVo, not flashed to an XT PE?

[Pinchy]

Yep, it happened to me as a pro vivo as well as the XT PE, although that was before i cleaned the CPU....

Anyway, i dont think it an internet problem, because even when im playing with bots on my own created server it happens. Plus, you can tell the difference between internet lag and computer lag....internet lag u generally freeze and move really quickly, computer lag is a contant thing and gets very annoying.

Im gonna try and clear my CMOS and update my mobo BIOS and see what happens. Though, it is a really hard thing to test for because you have to constantly be playing.

Thanks for all the help so far :)

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[Azn Tr14dZ]

K, tell us if you fixed the problem.

[Pinchy]

:eek: i was just running ATi tool and i decided to scan for artifacts...and i get yellow dots every second with the beeping sound...yet i never get any artifacts in the 3d view thing and never any in games :confused:

Would that somehow be the problem?

(havent updated mobo or cleared CMOS yet)

EDIT: How do you clear CMOS? I cant do it via the motherboard utility because foxconn has changed their site, and the mobo utility can't live update for the BIOS file and when i get the BIOS file it says it is wrong BIOS for system, although its the right one

I am pretty sure that i have an up-to-date BIOS though because i have updated it recently

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[Pinchy]

Ok, i done all the motherboard BIOS and clearing of CMOS and still, i get drops from 60FPS to 9-15 FPS...and it happens all of a sudden, like it just clicks into the lower FPS.

[Azn Tr14dZ]

Hm...that's really wierd. Can you flash back to ViVo and RMA?

[Pinchy]

I have a strong feeling it is somehow a heating issue. I put my hand next to the vent under the gfx card, and i can feel warm air. This doesnt happen when doing the 3D view, yet happens when playing CS for a while. I have a case fan on the side pointing cool air directly @ the cpu, one case fan at the back blowing air sideways onto the cpu and air on top of the gfx card, and one on the front of the case pouring air onto the hard disks. The LED fan on the side of the case brings a lot of air, the other two not as much. The vent i can feel the air coming out of is below the side case fan.

I do not really mind that i get artifacts in ATi tool, because it happens no where else. But is there any way of checking the temps or recording the temps of the comp WHILE in a game? I can minimize the game, but as soon as you minimise, the temps immediatly go back to how they are without the game.

Thanks again for all the help.

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[trog100]

well the atitool furry dice thing is perfect for testing temps.. if anything it heats the card up more then a real game..

but if u have the atitool 3dect set to load a faster 3d profile the "windowed" furry dice wont trigger the faster 3d speed.. nothing in a window will.. things have to be full screen to trigger 3d detect..

but if u set the speed or load the faster profile manually.. the atitool furry dice thing will show up any artifacts or problems caused by heat or the card clocked too high..

if the furry dice runs okay for a time and the heat is okay.. a game should play okay..

that furry dice thing might look small but it works the card as much as any game does.. and makes it run just as hot.. hotter in my experience..

if the furry dice thing shows problems.. so will the game.. fact of life..

u dont need to run scan for artifacts.. just run the furry dice and look at it and the fps it shows..

but to ignore artifacts in the furry dice aint wise.. i think u are running your core/memory too fast.. what shows up as artifacts in the tool could show up as the frame rate drops in your game.. your card is still tripping over its own feet.. just in a different way..

trog

[Pinchy]

I dont get what you mean by that...with the 3D moving hairy box thing, "Show 3D view" in ATi tool, i get NO artifacts @ all, and an average of like 257 FPS. It is only when i goto "Scan for artifacts" i get the artifacts. When i first start my computer up or when the comp is cool, i scan for higher core or memory clocks and they actually go up...but after a minute or so of going up, artifacts start to appear and it goes down to default.

I was just thinking about it...i have only run the 3D view for about 10-15 minutes and when i play CS i play for around an hour or more till it happens. Also, i think CS will take more of a CPU strain with all the online players or bots i add.

I wish there was a way of testing your temps while in game :p

Does anyone else think its heat?

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[mmx]

is fraps runing? because atitool detects it as artifacts.
Edit: what kind of psu do you have??

[bikr692002]

I dont get what you mean by that...with the 3D moving hairy box thing, "Show 3D view" in ATi tool, i get NO artifacts @ all, and an average of like 257 FPS. It is only when i goto "Scan for artifacts" i get the artifacts. When i first start my computer up or when the comp is cool, i scan for higher core or memory clocks and they actually go up...but after a minute or so of going up, artifacts start to appear and it goes down to default.

I was just thinking about it...i have only run the 3D view for about 10-15 minutes and when i play CS i play for around an hour or more till it happens. Also, i think CS will take more of a CPU strain with all the online players or bots i add.

I wish there was a way of testing your temps while in game :p

Does anyone else think its heat?

Cheers :toast:
Pinchyalot of times you can't see artifacts with your bare eyes.

[trog100]

what happens when u do a simple thing like loop 3dmark 2005 or 2006 for an hour..

looping 2006 will heat up your system far more than any game will.. if it loops 2006 for an hour with no problems there is nothing wrong with it.. if u only get the problem with the game the problem is the game..

trog

[Pinchy]

I got a 400W PSU. How do you run 3dmark06 in a loop? can you do it in basic edition? Or do you mean just click "run 3dmark" everytime it finishes?

[trog100]

not sure about the auto loop (keeping running on its own) with the freeware.. but just keeping running as it finishes will do the same thing..

if it survives an hour or so of that there isnt anything wrong with it.. if it has problems that will show it up..

trog

[Pinchy]

Hey

I just finished the tests now :)

I started at 11:10 and finished at 12:20, and ran 6 tests. (I tried to hit run as soon as the previous test finished)

3d Mark Scores:
Test 1: 2099
Test 2: 2106
Test 3: 2096
Test 4: 2103
Test 5: 2087
Test 6: 2095

The absolute max between each test would have been like 2-3 minutes.

But even after all these tests, i put my hand next to the vent and feel no hot air, but when i play CS, i can feel warm air coming out.

EDIT: I was playing Warcraft3: Frozen Throne with a friend on LAN yesterday, me being the host, and i got NO problems whatsoever on full settings...and we played for a couple of hours

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[trog100]

okay.. take my word for it 2006 is a grueling test.. i am certain there is nothing wrong with your card or the ati drivers..

sooo that just leaves some problem with the game.. no way can a game work your card harder than 2006 does.. i think u have a connection/ping online problem..

trog

[Pinchy]

How can it be an online problem if when i am offline and add bots it still happens? Could it be that i ran the 3dmark tests like 2-3 minutes apart? And why is there more heat in the case with CS than 3dmark, because when i play CS for a while (around an hour) i can feel the warm air near the vent, yet 3dmark i got nothing.

Thanks for the reply :)

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[mmx]

How can it be an online problem if when i am offline and add bots it still happens? Could it be that i ran the 3dmark tests like 2-3 minutes apart? And why is there more heat in the case with CS than 3dmark, because when i play CS for a while (around an hour) i can feel the warm air near the vent, yet 3dmark i got nothing.

Thanks for the reply :)

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy
CS doesnt stress you card as mutch as 3dmark06, but it stresses your CPU, observ the temps on the cpu i think the heat comes from there...

[trog100]

2006 or 2005 stresses or at least heats my cpu more than any game i have.. i know cos i have a cpu temp warning bleep set to go off at 65c..

only two thing have ever triggered this bleep.. 3dmark 2006 and 2005.. they do it on a regular basis..

no game or anything else ever has.. oblivion.. fear u name it.. only the two 3dmarks get my cpu hovering around the 65c mark..

i know games dont put a full time 100% load on the cpu.. or at least i know with my cpu they dont.. i am pretty sure the two 3dmarks do thow..

as for pinchy getting nothing.. it dosnt make sense.. i can think of no possible or logical explanation for it.. he he he

it does however appear to be a particular game problem he has.. on or offline..

trog

ps.. try running with your case side off pinchy.. see what happens..

[Batou1986]

about testing temps in game ati tray tools comes with a nifty osd option that will overlay your fps fan speed core and environment temps vid card clock speeds what 3d api the game is running and how much free texture memory is free how much video memory is free and how much system memory is being used by the program all of these options can be toggled on and off in att and for those wondering how your video memory and texture memory can be different if you have an agp card if u haven't noticed in your bios theres an option to set how much ram can be used as an extra buffer for the texture memory

[Pinchy]

I originally thought it was my CPU because as i said earlier, when the FPS was dropping in 2-3 minutes, it was because of a dirty CPU. I left the 3D view open for a hour and 30 minutes yesterday, and my GPU didnt go over 51*C...so its not the card. My CPU didnt go over 47*C but CS takes a lot out of the CPU especially when playing 16 on 16.

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[trog100]

try running this thing.. its a little gizmo that logs your memory and cpu usage while its running.. its freeware and quite neat..

http://cpu.rightmark.org/products/rmgotcha.shtml

if your pagefile usage ever exceeds your actual physical installed memory your system is swopfileing and u need more memory.. either way its a neat little tool..

trog

[Pinchy]

I was just playing, running the program, and the CPU never went over 83%, even when the lower FPS started to happen. Now, every now and then (like 50% of the time), i get artifacts in the game :(
The artifacts may have been caused from my new driver update (6.4 to 6.5) or the fact that the CS:S engine just updated.

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[blackvenom]

when you updated your drivers did you use driver cleaner as well? i had the same issue once before when the old drivers were not deleted properly and it was causing fps drops in my games. :)

[Pinchy]

I didnt use driver cleaner, but i did use ATi's uninstaller, which removes all ati drivers/products

[blackvenom]

I didnt use driver cleaner, but i did use ATi's uninstaller, which removes all ati drivers/products

I still use driver cleaner even after using ATI's uninstaller.

[Pinchy]

would it make a difference? I mean, i was getting the fps drops even before i updated the driver...

What i also find strange is that when i get the FPS drops, i restart my computer, and it is fine again after the re-start.

Thanks for the fast reply's.
Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[Pinchy]

UPDATE: i was just playing then, and i noticed just as the FPS drop occurs, my computer makes a high pitched ringing sound...if that is any help

[blackvenom]

another thing you may want to check, especially if your using the newest drivers with CCC, is to make sure you dont have any graphics options enabled that are meant for the X1k series hards, which may wank out your fps. I believe some of the options are temporal AA and Catalyst AI. Have you tried running Adaware and Spyware removal programs yet?

[Pinchy]

I leave everything as default in catalyst control centre, but just then i cliked the box "Disable Catalyst AI", so im assuming it was on before. I'll get back to you's when i play next.

With spyware, i have trend micro, which has an anti-spyware blocker as well as a scanner. Im pretty sure i have no spyware as i formatted my comp before i put the card in.

Oh and another thing, the artifacts start to appear in the game AFTER gameplay - they are not there straight away, they only start once i have been playing for like 30-40 minutes. Can a CPU overheating cause artifacts? I know a GPU overheating can, but my GPU has an arctic cooler, and that keeps it cool.

Thanks for all the help :)

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[Pinchy]

Hey everyone,
I know this is a little bit of a late post...but PROBLEM FIXED :)

I bought a gigabyte G-power Pro cpu cooler, put it on and works like a charm :)...no problems at all. Thanks for all the help!

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

[trog100]

the answer to a problem is always the interesting part..

glad u got it sorted..

trog

[DRDNA]

I dont get what you mean by that...with the 3D moving hairy box thing, "Show 3D view" in ATi tool, i get NO artifacts @ all, and an average of like 257 FPS. It is only when i goto "Scan for artifacts" i get the artifacts. When i first start my computer up or when the comp is cool, i scan for higher core or memory clocks and they actually go up...but after a minute or so of going up, artifacts start to appear and it goes down to default.

I was just thinking about it...i have only run the 3D view for about 10-15 minutes and when i play CS i play for around an hour or more till it happens. Also, i think CS will take more of a CPU strain with all the online players or bots i add.

I wish there was a way of testing your temps while in game :p

Does anyone else think its heat?

Cheers :toast:
Pinchy

Check the air intake on graphic card for dust build up.