AMD Native x86 Quad-Cores Shipping In August

[error_f0rce]

AMD announced today that Quad-Core AMD Opteron™ processors, code-named “Barcelona,” are planned for shipment in both standard and low power versions at launch later this summer. This would be the first time AMD has made both standard and low power parts immediately available as part of a new processor launch.

During this first launch, processor speeds are expected to be available up to 2.0 GHz.

Source: AMD.com (http://www.amd.com/us-en/Corporate/VirtualPressRoom/0,,51_104_543~118193,00.html)

[WarEagleAU]

nice native quad core. now if they can get the phenoms up in normal time.

[DaMulta]

I wonder what socket they will be.

[a111087]

probably F socket

[Random Murderer]

probably F socket

nope. am3. amd announced that they will be reverse-compatible with am2.

[Atech]

nope. am3. amd announced that they will be reverse-compatible with am2.
What, even with these pre-"consumer" release workstation and server orientated Opterons?

That kind of defeats their tried and tested release model :/ I really hope they know what they're doing ... where's the incentive for non-professionals to wait for non-professional orientated processors?

So basically their early professional-orientated Opterons are exactly the same as the non-professionally orientated processors. They're just literally rebranded processors. So not even ECC memory, or more HT links? Does this mean that we'll basically (as non-professionals) be able to scale these processors linearly with appropriate mainboards?

Edit: Didn't mean to thank you. Clicked on the wrong darned button.

Edit #2: Coming to thing about it, this is brilliant news for customers. No longer needing to pay for enterprise hardware ... Sun Microsystems out of business in 5, 4, 3 ... :P

[Easy Rhino]

what about 64bit?

[Ripper3]

I think/hope it's native quad-core, and was supposed to be x86-64, but who knows, maybe AMD is planning on doing a completely turn around saying, "Y'know what? Fuck 64-bit"
After that, they then shoot down ATi, and go off to hang themselves.

Either that or it could just be a typo. Who knows.

[hat]

4 cores. 32 bit?

[rampage]

im thinking the same ... only 32 bit?? no 64 bit?

[kwchang007]

defiantly 64 bit compatible.....considering they have 64 bit compatible cpus out now. this is good news......something to finally compete with kentsfield, competition only benfits the consumer :toast:

[ChaoticBlankness]

Technically the 64bit we all know and love is a form of x86. More specifically called, x86-64.

However marketing people like to call it X64, AMD64 (Even though AMD did "invent" it), and INTEL 64 which was previously called EM64T.

[a111087]

thats cool, don't have to buy another mobo :)

[ChaoticBlankness]

nope. am3. amd announced that they will be reverse-compatible with am2.

It's actually AM2+, AM3 will have DDR3 support.

[trt740]

AMD announced today that Quad-Core AMD Opteron™ processors, code-named “Barcelona,” are planned for shipment in both standard and low power versions at launch later this summer. This would be the first time AMD has made both standard and low power parts immediately available as part of a new processor launch.

During this first launch, processor speeds are expected to be available up to 2.0 GHz.

[---]

Source: AMD.com (http://www.amd.com/us-en/Corporate/VirtualPressRoom/0,,51_104_543~118193,00.html)


Thank freaking goodness hope this turns out alright AMD has had a hard way to go lately.

[PVTCaboose1337]

So does this mean it will work in my mobo!?!?!

[hat]

You can answer that question by asking yourself if your motherboard is AM2. If the answer is yes, the other answer is yes.

[ryboto]

It's actually AM2+, AM3 will have DDR3 support.

Actually, Barcelona is Socket 1207, not AM2+. Budapest is the chip for desktops.

[Atech]

Actually, Barcelona is Socket 1207, not AM2+. Budapest is the chip for desktops.
I thought someone was being somewhat overly optimistic ;)

[Widjaja]

I've just gone to an AMD rig and finding it way better than my Intel P4.
Hope fully AMD do a good job of this CPU and beat the Intel C2D.

[DanTheBanjoman]

I have the feeling that with every news about Barcelona people start comparing it to C2D and I end up saying that Barcelona is no a desktop product and therefor it is pointless to compare it.

[Dippyskoodlez]

I have the feeling that with every news about Barcelona people start comparing it to C2D and I end up saying that Barcelona is no a desktop product and therefor it is pointless to compare it.

Its all people know ;)

[ryboto]

I have the feeling that with every news about Barcelona people start comparing it to C2D and I end up saying that Barcelona is no a desktop product and therefor it is pointless to compare it.

Just because it's a server part, doesn't mean we can't compare. The Xeons use the same Core 2 arch that the C2D's use. The Barcelona chips are the same K10 arch that will go into the desktop, so why can't we test them against each other?

[Dippyskoodlez]

Just because it's a server part, doesn't mean we can't compare. The Xeons use the same Core 2 arch that the C2D's use. The Barcelona chips are the same K10 arch that will go into the desktop, so why can't we test them against each other?

http://images.apple.com/xserve/images/architecturediagram_20060807.jpg

is why.

May I draw your attention to the part labeled #2.

Also known as a 256bit memory bus.

[DanTheBanjoman]

Just because it's a server part, doesn't mean we can't compare. The Xeons use the same Core 2 arch that the C2D's use. The Barcelona chips are the same K10 arch that will go into the desktop, so why can't we test them against each other?

Like Dippy said, it's a different platform. Different chipset, different memory subsystem. Who cares if the server platform beats the competitions desktop platform?

[ryboto]

Like Dippy said, it's a different platform. Different chipset, different memory subsystem. Who cares if the server platform beats the competitions desktop platform?

I care, because it's the K10, it's going to come to the desktop, so why not compare it?

[Dippyskoodlez]

I care, because it's the K10, it's going to come to the desktop, so why not compare it?

Is the xeon the same?

No.

Is a barcelona going to necessarily be the same?

No.

Remember how AMD originally wanted to seperate socket 940 from 754?

What makes you think they wont? Intel did.

[jpierce55]

A sign of major improvement is a sign of major improvement, one way or another that is what we all should hope to see. If AMD does not keep up on improving technology you can expect Intel to back down and take it easy in another year or two as well. Lets keep the ball rolling!

[DanTheBanjoman]

I care, because it's the K10, it's going to come to the desktop, so why not compare it?

You just quoted the answer to your own question. :S

[ryboto]

Is the xeon the same?

No.

Is a barcelona going to necessarily be the same?

No.

Remember how AMD originally wanted to seperate socket 940 from 754?

What makes you think they wont? Intel did.

The new Xeons use Core 2 architecture....so, how are they not similar? So, you're telling me, a comparison of the Barcelona against the Current Kentsfield Xeons isn't proper? Of course they'll have different chipsets and other factors, but you're saying that we can't make comparisons????? Fine then, lets not compare Barcelona to the desktop, lets compare it to server parts, because that will be their major competition. Since Barcelona is going to be completely different from the arch used in Agena or Kuma chips! Really, I don't understand your stance here. Are you basically saying the only way to compare the two arch's is to use the exact same components? Why can't we make a platform comparison?

[Dippyskoodlez]

Why can't we make a platform comparison?


Do you not understand what we are comparing here?

the Xeon has QUAD CHANNEL DDR2.

The core 2 duo does NOT.

The arena is like comparing a nascar car to an F1 car.

They are different.


besides, you aren't actually "comparing" the CPU's because theres no performance data anywhere in this thread.

This it should remain, a server CPU argument, because its in no way shape or form related to the desktop as no specifications about the CPU are known other than a clockspeed.

Chances are a dual dual core Xeon is going to stomp a core 4 quad desktop CPU.

[DanTheBanjoman]

Well first of all the current Xeon MP's don't use the Core2 architecture, so bye bye argument of them being the same. (still stuck using Netburst, Core2 variants will appear in September (http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20070628234218.html))

Next to that, we're not talking about a small difference, we're talking about a completely different infrastructure, Tigerton will utilize CSI instead of the current FSB, it has many interlinks to handle the bandwidth for the 16 cores these beasts will initially house. Look at IBM's X4 chipset for example. IBM you say? Yes, IBM makes chipsets for these kind of systems, completely different league.

Long story short, wait for both platforms to appear, then see how they perform, forget about C2D and Xeon DP's here.

[Dippyskoodlez]

Well first of all the current Xeon MP's don't use the Core2 architecture, so bye bye argument of them being the same. (still stuck using Netburst, Core2 variants will appear in September (http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20070628234218.html))
.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117094

You can't multi-CPU those? ;)

Last I checked, woodcrest and clovertown were core based :)

[DanTheBanjoman]

Woodcrest and Clovertown are Xeon DP's, not MP's. You can't run them in multi_CPU configurations.

[Dippyskoodlez]

So whats apple use to get a dual woodcrest?

http://store.apple.com/AppleStore/WebObjects/BizCustom.woa/6314008/wo/pM1dOnyABbdT2o6HAd01fYl1Geu/1.?p=0

[DanTheBanjoman]

So whats apple use to get a dual woodcrest?

http://store.apple.com/AppleStore/WebObjects/BizCustom.woa/6314008/wo/pM1dOnyABbdT2o6HAd01fYl1Geu/1.?p=0

Dual != multi. Completely different market.

[Dippyskoodlez]

Dual != multi. Completely different market.

Multi = >1 ;D

Anything 4+ is really not a concern for 99% of the population here xD

However, the dual CPU argument remains the same. Its different.

[DanTheBanjoman]

Xeon DP = Xeon Dual Processor, 5000 series
Xeon MP = Xeon Multi Processor, 7000 series
Has been like that since the first Xeons, they're 2 completely different markets. Same with the Opterons, 1xx, 2xx and 8xx.

[Dippyskoodlez]

Xeon DP = Xeon Dual Processor, 5000 series
Xeon MP = Xeon Multi Processor, 7000 series
Has been like that since the first Xeons, they're 2 completely different markets. Same with the Opterons, 1xx, 2xx and 8xx.

They haven't migrated the core series to 4+ cpu's yet?

Thats insanely retarded. I figured that would be one of the first places they would want to stick the suckers.

[DanTheBanjoman]

That's what I said yes, Tigerton will be the first Core2 Xeon MP. Though it will introduce a lot of new features, really has a huge potential. Then again, like you said, this market isn't for us.

[informal]

I just wanted to clear up some things regarding K10 MPU(Barcelona,Budapest,Phenom).

First of all,Barcelona is a K10 server part that fits in both Socket F and SocketF+(split power planes) with only the BIOS update(info directly from AMD!!).So it's backwards compatible with ANY socket F motherboard for dual core Opterons currently shipping(RevF stepping).Second ,Barcelona is K10 chip with HyperTransport 1.0 support,not HT3.0.Barcelona is coming in August with speeds up to 2Ghz,with Tier 1 suppliers having the systems in September.Both standard and HE(low power ,68W) versions will be available.

The HT3.0 K10 chip is codenamed Budapest and will come in late Q3,early Q4 and will be a workstation MPU,for uniprocessor systems( UP).It will fit in ANY AM2 or AM2+(split power planes) with only a BIOS update!!So it's not a desktop CPU,but will work regardless of that in any desktop mobo(provided the BIOS is available).


Phenom is Ht3.0 desktop part which comes in November and is basically identical to Budapest and Barcelona(only the Barcelona has HT1.0).Chip has all the features of K10 core arch(improved OoO,32 byte instruction fetch ,L3 cache,improved mem. contrl with prefetch function,L1 direct prefetching,doubled L1 bandwidth,128bit FPU/SSE,SSE4A instruction set,increased number of fast path(direct path) instructions etc.)
Phenom will wit in ANY AM2 or AM2+(split power planes) with only a BIOS update needed.

All K10 CPUs have DDR2 integrated mem. controller with support for DDR2 memory(rumor has it that they do support DDR3 also,but still just a rumor).All K10 CPus,when ran in AM2+ mobo can clock independently the mem. controller from the CPU cores.So meme .controller has it's own PLL and can work on higher or lower freq.This will have a large impact on OCing,since the mem. controller has its own voltage plane and can work on less volts and less freq. than the cores themselves.
All K10 CPUs have much better power saving features than K8(and Conroe,Penryn).This will allow K10 to be the most power efficient CPU on the market.
All K10 CPUs will receive a die shrink to 45nm with some arch. improvements in Q3 2008,and will be a competitors to intels Nehalem.All this K10.5(shrank) CPUs will have increased L2&L3 caches,SSE4(full subset) and other improvements to SSE and ALU engines(to help them compete better with nehalem)

I just wanted to post this information since i saw that too many people on this board really don't have correct informations about K10 and motherboard support for it,so i wanted to clear up some things.
I must say that these specs are correct and not just some speculation.
Hope this info helps clear the confusion around the mighty K10 ;)


Regards
inf

[Dippyskoodlez]

I just wanted to post this information since i saw that too many people on this board really doesn't know correct inform. about K10 and motherboard support for it,so i wanted to clear up some things.
I must say that these specs are correct and not just some speculation.
Hope thsi inf ohelps clear the confusion around the mighty K10 ;)


Regards
inf

never seen you before. (lookie, just signed up :p )

But I'm curious as to where you got info :)

L3 cache

:eek:

I'm pretty sure most of those were announced in the past, but theres just no benchmark information at hand, so we really can't conclude much for performance.

It sure sounds like its got some extra muscle coming, but it needs to hurry or its going to be competing with even more muscle from intel...

[informal]

L3 cache is old news,look at Analyst Day 2006.So its practically 1 year old info.
Yeah,i registered here since i couldn't believe my eyes when i read some posts :(.I thought people here knew more about K10,but lets hope it all changes since K10 is practically 1.5 months away from public demonstration.

PS Info was from various friends ;) and from public(Ace's hardware forum) and Analyst day papers.Also those pesky little patents at US patent office could get handy :).

[Dippyskoodlez]

L3 cache is old news,look at Analyst Day 2006.So its practically 1 year old info.
Yeah,i registered here since i couldn't believe my eyes when i read some posts :(.I thought people here knew more about K10,but lets hope it all changes since K10 is practically 1.5 months away from public demonstration.

PS Info was from various friends ;) and from public(Ace's hardware forum) and Analyst day papers.Also those pesky little patents at US patent office could get handy :).

:roll:

A lot of the old info is just..... old.

If its true, they probably won't be changing a ton as right now I would imagine they're working on getting it made..

[informal]

They are stockpiling Barcelona as we speak :).They have been doing that since last 3 months lol :).

And there is no "if it's true".No if at all.
L3 is one major arch . improvement AMD made when they designed K10.Although it isn't the greatest of all ,it is the one that people get stuck on when they read the specs on the newegg :D.And it will bring a lot in multithreaded apps and multitasking environments.

[Dippyskoodlez]

They are stockpiling Barcelona as we speak :).They have been doing that since last 3 months lol :).

And there is no "if it's true".No if at all.
L3 is one major arch . improvement AMD made when they designed K10.Although it isn't the greatest of all ,it is the one that people get stuck on when they read the specs on the newegg :D.And it will bring a lot in multithreaded apps and multitasking environments.

Its... L3 :ohwell:

Aren't they sharing this like Intel does, though?

Its not so much the addition of L3, but more so the implementation.

Happen to have any CPU diagrams laying around? :D

I'd really like to see how its laid out in comparison to the K8 currently.

[informal]

Yes i do :).I will be adding the photo of die plot soon.Stay tuned :).

Here ya go:

http://chip-architect.com/news/2007_02_19_Various_Images.html (all cores from K8 to K10,Conroe and Penryn included)

Here is a K10 core(without Mem. controller and L3) overview diagram:

http://chip-architect.com/news/K8L_floorplan_720.jpg

Here is a die plot(all parts included):
http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2006/1013/kaigai03l.gif

[Dippyskoodlez]

Yes i do :).I will be adding the photo of die plot soon.Stay tuned :).

http://img.techpowerup.org/070701/Barcelona-1.gif

Win. :)

Looks like we should see a significant improvement with ddr2, alone.

http://www.realworldtech.com/includes/templates/articles.cfm?ArticleID=RWT051607033728&mode=print

[ryboto]

I don't even know what you guys were arguing with me about before. Newegg is selling Kentsfield Xeons, aren't those Core2? In any event, I want to see some benchmarks, not this paper launch crap. They must have gotten at least 1 system to work up to par at this point, why not show the public some performance comparisons that live up to the hype they've been trying to sell us.

[informal]

I couldn't upload from my PC so i had to lookup on the net :).Anyway,my die plots are way better than yours :P.

[Dippyskoodlez]

I couldn't upload from my PC so i had to lookup on the net :).Anyway,my die plots are way better than yours :P.

http://www.realworldtech.com/includes/images/articles/Barcelona-6.gif


?

:p

From my link above.

[informal]

ryboto,AMD is not intel.They do things differently.So you will have to wait for benches some 1.5moths more :).And anyhow,why do you care about how it performs,since you think it will be worse than Conroe based Xeons??If you like intel more,nothing bad with that.But bashing AMD for doing their business the way they do is.It's their company,they do what they think is best for them.And i for once agree with their strategy for K10 introduction.The chip is PITA to produce and they are doing their best to make it happen.And the chip is very fast,no doubt about that(Alpha version of the chip was around 10% faster than C2Q(uad) clock for clock,early alpha to be more precise!).So if alpha (which was full of bugs and with disabled parts of the chip) was 10% better ,what you think retail will do to Clowerton and Penry?Sourse for this is a XIP at XtremeSystems named s7even(who had a look at the chip in early february of this year)

[informal]

Well for a guy who didn't know K10 even had L3 :D ,you are not bad :D.Still you have a lot of catching up to do :D ;)

Cheers

[Dippyskoodlez]

Well for a guy who didn't know K10 even had L3 :D ,you are not bad :D.Still you have a lot of catching up to do :D ;)

Cheers

yeah, Its been a while since I looked at the stuff. I don't remember many of the changes.

I imagine once school starts back up, I'll go full bore again. :cool:

[ryboto]

ryboto,AMD is not intel.They do things differently.So you will have to wait for benches some 1.5moths more :).And anyhow,why do you care about how it performs,since you think it will be worse than Conroe based Xeons??If you like intel more,nothing bad with that.But bashing AMD for doing their business the way they do is.It's their company,they do what they think is best for them.And i for once agree with their strategy for K10 introduction.The chip is PITA to produce and they are doing their best to make it happen.And the chip is very fast,no doubt about that(Alpha version of the chip was around 10% faster than C2Q(uad) clock for clock,early alpha to be more precise!).So if alpha (which was full of bugs and with disabled parts of the chip) was 10% better ,what you think retail will do to Clowerton and Penry?Sourse for this is a XIP at XtremeSystems named s7even(who had a look at the chip in early february of this year)

I never bashed AMD. I defend them if anything. I'm not sure where you picked up that I was being negative towards them. I was just trying to defend myself against users here, well, not really defend, more like trying to clear some things up.

[informal]

Oh sorry i misread something than :(.Anyway ,little more to go till benches appear.Let's hope it makes a debut in July.

[mandelore]

Rawr!

[Wile E]

I thought I read somewhere that the mem controller on these can only do up to DDR2-667, albeit w/ ECC. Any truth to that?

[Dippyskoodlez]

I thought I read somewhere that the mem controller on these can only do up to DDR2-667, albeit w/ ECC. Any truth to that?

We'll actually see an improvement with DDR2(with this revision), but mem controller limitation at 667? I doubt it. Possibly an old revision, but its been forever since they've made any samples available to even look at, letalone test.

[informal]

Limitation of 667MHz Registered Ram comes only with Barcelona(Server part).
Desktop parts will fully support & utilize 1066Mhz(and bellow) DDR2 memory.