Sapphire Radeon x1800 XT and power requirements

[Rinnerz]

Hey all,

I plan on building myself a new rig within the next couple of months so I don't have to rely on the atrocity that is my laptop. Over the last few days, I've been bouncing back and forth between ATI and nVidia cards to try to find one that may be within my price range, while -not- being a major power hog.

Right now, these are the specs I am considering:

ASUS M2R32-MVP Mobo
AMD Athlon 64 x2 4000+ AM2 processor
1 GB DDR2-667 RAM, PC-5300
Western Digital 160 GB SATA HDD 7200 RPM
Sapphire Radeon x1800 XT 512 MB PCI-Express
Antec Lifestyle Sonata III ATX Tower (Earthwatts 500 PSU)

Note that I don't plan for this to be an extremely hardcore gaming rig--just enough to play World of Warcraft, Tomb Raider Legend, and possibly Half Life 2 and Counter Strike: Source well.

My question is... while I've read that the x1800 XT has a minimum power requirement of "350W with specialized 12V graphics card connector", is it guaranteed that the Earthwatts 500 will be more than sufficient for it? And what about when/if I decide to get another x1800 XT and Crossfire them? Any idea?

[niko084]

That psu will run 1 just fine with that setup, I wouldn't do crossfire with them though....

If you want something a little less power hungry get a 1950pro, or better yet
get a 2600xt gddr4 version, they are now outrunning 1950pro's with 7.8 drivers.

Curious what resolution will you be running in?

[Namslas90]

Equal chances that that PSU will power what you need and probably not last as long as you would like. The problem is that cases that come with PSU"S don't list the specs of the PSU.
More important than the wattage is the AMPS. An X1800 series card realy needs around 18 to 22 amps on the 12v PCI-E rail. Any less than this and the PSU will end up working to hard to power the system and will probably die within a year or less. Not to mention the fact that most of these "cases with PSU" have realy low quality PSU's.
If you go with that PSU then plan on replacing it SOON, most of the time when a PSU "goes out" it takes another component with it (IE: CPU, MOBO etc).

:toast:

[Rurouni Strife]

I'm pretty sure that that Earthwatts 500 will be fine. As long as it has 18 amps on the 12 volt rail or whatever the video cars specs say.

That gaming rig you want to build will actually run games quite well, definately enough for WoW and HL2/CSS. TRL will run like a dream too. I have an x1800GTO and it even plays Bioshock maxed out (well, 4xaf and no aa) at 1280x960 and that is fine by me. The x1800XT would probably do that at 1280x1024. If anything, get another gig of ram. Crossfire isnt worth it for the games you listed.

Where are you getting the x1800xt btw?

[Rinnerz]

That psu will run 1 just fine with that setup, I wouldn't do crossfire with them though....

If you want something a little less power hungry get a 1950pro, or better yet
get a 2600xt gddr4 version, they are now outrunning 1950pro's with 7.8 drivers.

Curious what resolution will you be running in?

Thanks for the reply. I most probably will -not- be trying Crossfire with them for a good year or so... and by then shelling out the cash for a better PSU would be fine.

I actually have been craving a x1950 Pro, but from everything I've read it seems to be more power hungry. Aside from label stating it needs 100W more than the x1800, many seem to be concerned with the continuous amperage being at least 30A or more... which usually means shelling out a lot more cash for, say, an Enermax Liberty 620W.

To answer your res question... meh, probably no higher than 1280x1024. :P I'm very easily pleased after having a laptop that can't go past 800x600 on WoW *cringe*

[Rinnerz]

I'm pretty sure that that Earthwatts 500 will be fine. As long as it has 18 amps on the 12 volt rail or whatever the video cars specs say.

That gaming rig you want to build will actually run games quite well, definately enough for WoW and HL2/CSS. TRL will run like a dream too. I have an x1800GTO and it even plays Bioshock maxed out (well, 4xaf and no aa) at 1280x960 and that is fine by me. The x1800XT would probably do that at 1280x1024. If anything, get another gig of ram. Crossfire isnt worth it for the games you listed.

Where are you getting the x1800xt btw?

Yeah, I asked about Crossfire more out of curiosity than anything else; I don't need it. With the Earthwatts 500, I was mainly concerned about the amps on the 12V rail. I can't seem to find detailed specs of the PSU to see how much it has.

Edit: Didn't see your last question there, sorry. I will most likely request a local distributor to order one for me. I live in Newfoundland, Canada, so... it'd be impossible to get one otherwise.

[Rinnerz]

Equal chances that that PSU will power what you need and probably not last as long as you would like. The problem is that cases that come with PSU"S don't list the specs of the PSU.
More important than the wattage is the AMPS. An X1800 series card realy needs around 18 to 22 amps on the 12v PCI-E rail. Any less than this and the PSU will end up working to hard to power the system and will probably die within a year or less. Not to mention the fact that most of these "cases with PSU" have realy low quality PSU's.
If you go with that PSU then plan on replacing it SOON, most of the time when a PSU "goes out" it takes another component with it (IE: CPU, MOBO etc).

:toast:

Yes... this is exactly why I am concerned about the Earthwatts 500. I've heard good things about it, and while it is shipped with this case it is also available separately. I don't want to skimp out on the PSU for the reasons you've mentioned, but I may not be able to shell out $200+ (Canadian) for a PSU just yet. So I'm still rather indecisive about it...

[niko084]

Thanks for the reply. I most probably will -not- be trying Crossfire with them for a good year or so... and by then shelling out the cash for a better PSU would be fine.

I actually have been craving a x1950 Pro, but from everything I've read it seems to be more power hungry. Aside from label stating it needs 100W more than the x1800, many seem to be concerned with the continuous amperage being at least 30A or more... which usually means shelling out a lot more cash for, say, an Enermax Liberty 620W.

To answer your res question... meh, probably no higher than 1280x1024. :P I'm very easily pleased after having a laptop that can't go past 800x600 on WoW *cringe*

Real world power draw on a fresh psu *capacitors are still good* the 1950pro will run fine on that psu also.... I have one running on a 450 watt Smart Power 2 Antec, runs fine been like that for about 8 months now.

They say numbers like 300-350 watts on 12volt because they base it on a base level system, so that is on 12volt not the card itself... I did a test on an 8800GTX it only drew 140ish watts...

Anyways a 1800xt draws 112 watts MAX, and with newer drivers they draw 103 watts MAX... So now that you compare that to amps, not even 10 amps.

Key is to have a good psu and don't overclock it until you get a better psu...

Although you wont "need" the power, a better quality power supply is always a good idea, but it seems you know that anyways :)

[niko084]

That psu is 2x 17amp 12volt rails... Same as on my Antec Smart Power 450

So just don't hook up too many hard drives, and if you know what your doing, you can bridge the 2 rails which would make you good and solid...

That psu rates very nicely and holds its voltages pretty well, although not high performance the quality seems to be decent.


***
I would still push ya to get a 2600xt 256mb if you are not running too big of resolutions, 1280x1024 is fine with 256 mb, and you can get a good one for under $140. Its beating the 1950pro and it may very well continue to perform better with new drivers, its already up almost 20% from its release.

[mitsirfishi]

you will need around 550watt easy plus atleast 35amps on your 12v rail to crossfire those

[Namslas90]

Yes... this is exactly why I am concerned about the Earthwatts 500. I've heard good things about it, and while it is shipped with this case it is also available separately. I don't want to skimp out on the PSU for the reasons you've mentioned, but I may not be able to shell out $200+ (Canadian) for a PSU just yet. So I'm still rather indecisive about it...

Took a quick look and found this alternative, the case isn't too bad but the PSU is good. Total from Newegg is around $200.

case;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119047

PSU;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703005

:toast:

[Rinnerz]

That psu is 2x 17amp 12volt rails... Same as on my Antec Smart Power 450

So just don't hook up too many hard drives, and if you know what your doing, you can bridge the 2 rails which would make you good and solid...

That psu rates very nicely and holds its voltages pretty well, although not high performance the quality seems to be decent.


***
I would still push ya to get a 2600xt 256mb if you are not running too big of resolutions, 1280x1024 is fine with 256 mb, and you can get a good one for under $140. Its beating the 1950pro and it may very well continue to perform better with new drivers, its already up almost 20% from its release.


Hrrmmm... yeah, my decision isn't final so far as video cards go. Let me put it this way: I have a roommate who owns a Sapphire Radeon x800 XL, 512 MB. I -love- the way it runs. My only complaint is its lack of support for Shader Model 3.0.

So... ideally, I want something that's a step or two up from that card. Nothing too demanding, or expensive. I just skimmed over the 2600 XT's specs... not bad. Does its mere 128-bit memory interface gimp it at all, though?

[mitsirfishi]

it depends on what res you play games at you could wait a short while and get the hd x2900pro in a few months

[Rinnerz]

Took a quick look and found this alternative, the case isn't too bad but the PSU is good. Total from Newegg is around $200.

case;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119047

PSU;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703005

:toast:


That was a mighty helpful post, thanks. I particularly like the PSU and its pricing. Good brand, good price. Unless I end up getting a much less demanding card, that'd probably be a good idea to get.

[Rurouni Strife]

I think you'll have a hard time finding a X1800XT, or any 1800 card for that matter. But what do i know, you live in Canada.

My personal card reccomendation would be a X1950 Pro, unless you have to have DX 10. If you have to have DX10, grab an 8800 GTS 320 or 2900XT, but those are more than likely out of your price range. 1950 Pro's are like, 135-45 USD for 256 mb variants, and at the resolution you use you'll be fine (Same resoulution i tend to use).

[niko084]

Hrrmmm... yeah, my decision isn't final so far as video cards go. Let me put it this way: I have a roommate who owns a Sapphire Radeon x800 XL, 512 MB. I -love- the way it runs. My only complaint is its lack of support for Shader Model 3.0.

So... ideally, I want something that's a step or two up from that card. Nothing too demanding, or expensive. I just skimmed over the 2600 XT's specs... not bad. Does its mere 128-bit memory interface gimp it at all, though?

Well it makes the 512mb version fairly useless so far anyways, under the condition you have a decent amount of system ram and the fps gains are near nothing and only in higher settings...

256-512 on the 2600xt in resolutions above 1280x1024 with high settings tend to see 2-6% more fps in a decent machine... So ya the extra ram isn't worth it.... Being the cards run REALLY slow at those high settings anyways the change doesn't matter.

Don't consider just the ram only being 128-bit, it is beating 1950pro's in Dx9 games and apps and obviously supports Dx10, and it uses less power, costs less, you can't really beat that right now. Would it be a better card with a 256-bit ya probably, but even with its 128-bit its performing quite well now, to the point I and many consider it "The" new bang for the buck card if you want Dx10 or low power...

I say if you want Dx10 or low power because a 1950xt will still beat it up pretty good in dx9 for if you get a good deal around the same price.

If you plan on running big resolutions 1600x1200 or bigger then a 512mb card will start to come in handy.

*********
You can't go purely off ratings and specs, even though a Intel Core 2 Duo 1.86 is only 1.86ghz at its stock speeds it will beat a Intel Extreme P4 3.4 HT by between 100-400% depending on the type of work its doing.

When they came out they were pretty slow no doubt, the 1650xt's were beating them... With new drivers they are performing quite very well, and expected to get more *don't know how much, but more*

[Merlin123]

Hi there, I just ordered the X1950 Pro online yesterday, before I found out about the power requirements. I have a Dell Dimension C521 (ok, I can hear the chuckles now), and the PSU is listed at a measly 280 Watts. Am I going to kill my system if I run the X1950 Pro in it? I actually don't do that much gaming anymore, mostly running 2D applications, and would like to power two displays for multi-table power mainly. From the discussion here, sounds like the HD 2600 XT uses less power, should I switch to that card instead, or is it still too much power demand on my poor Dell PSU?

Thanks.

[Namslas90]

Hi there, I just ordered the X1950 Pro online yesterday, before I found out about the power requirements. I have a Dell Dimension C521 (ok, I can hear the chuckles now), and the PSU is listed at a measly 280 Watts. Am I going to kill my system if I run the X1950 Pro in it? I actually don't do that much gaming anymore, mostly running 2D applications, and would like to power two displays for multi-table power mainly. From the discussion here, sounds like the HD 2600 XT uses less power, should I switch to that card instead, or is it still too much power demand on my poor Dell PSU?

Thanks.

You should replace that stock PSU anyways, remember you can use the new PSU in a new build also(providing it fits in the DELL case). You may have to cut a bigger hole in the back of ther case to install the new PSU(no big deal have done it many times). Either Video card will give you much better performance over what you have, and you can still use it in a future new build. It all depends on when you want to buy a card for DX10 and ^ support. If you can do it now, go for a X2xxx series card, it will hold you over much longer than the 1950.

:toast:

[Merlin123]

Thanks for the reply, I will change my order to the HD 2600 XT then. Just noticed it comes with 512MB instead of the 256MB on the X1950 Pro, costs $50 more, but what the heck.

I just bought the Dell machine, so I am a bit leary with replacing the PSU and voiding the warrantee. Do you think the PSU will run the HD 2600 XT ok for the next year, at which time I can upgrade the PSU, or build a new rig that is more suitable for gaming?

Thanks.

[Namslas90]

Thanks for the reply, I will change my order to the HD 2600 XT then. Just noticed it comes with 512MB instead of the 256MB on the X1950 Pro, costs $50 more, but what the heck.

I just bought the Dell machine, so I am a bit leary with replacing the PSU and voiding the warrantee. Do you think the PSU will run the HD 2600 XT ok for the next year, at which time I can upgrade the PSU, or build a new rig that is more suitable for gaming?

Thanks.

Chances are slim that it will stay stable with such low power. You can always ask Dell for an upgrade PSU; It will cost more than it's worth, but will keep the warranty intact.

:toast:

[niko084]

Thanks for the reply, I will change my order to the HD 2600 XT then. Just noticed it comes with 512MB instead of the 256MB on the X1950 Pro, costs $50 more, but what the heck.

I just bought the Dell machine, so I am a bit leary with replacing the PSU and voiding the warrantee. Do you think the PSU will run the HD 2600 XT ok for the next year, at which time I can upgrade the PSU, or build a new rig that is more suitable for gaming?

Thanks.

Don't bother with the 512mb version unless you have less than 1 gig of system ram, you wont gain anything.

But ya its now to the point the 1950pro is about dead.
Wouldn't replace it if you already had one, but if your buying new, no sense in buying a 1950pro when you can buy a 2600xt gddr4 for less money or right around the same and get the same and in some cases better performance with less power draw.

Unless you have linux because its not supported by linux yet....