How-to: Pencil mod your HD 3870!

[asb2106]

http://img.techpowerup.org/080102/hd3870pmodsl4828.png

Apparently the second pencilmod point works better.

If I wanted to do a hardmod to my card, would I use any of these points for the positive?

I would imagine just grounding to one of the neg's on the power connector.

and if Im not mistaken its a 100k pot trimmer, right? then turn the resistance to the max and lower it to increase the voltage.....

Also.... by doing the hardmod, what is the max the voltage can get to with the hard mod, just an estimate....? just wonderin

BTW my cards are WCed

[eidairaman1]

i know this is out of topic, but yesterday, i had my machine apart for cleaning, i was looking at my 1950 Pro and i noticed 2 DIP switches on it, i wonder what they do.

Sapphire Radeon 1950 Pro AGP.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

The red points, yes. I just stick the ground to the case (like where the side panel locks into).

100k ohm trimmer is correct for vCore mod. Also correct on setup. Test trimmer for MAX resistance then tune down (checking voltages as you go).

I don't think OVP kicks in until 1.9V, IIRC. I've had mine to 1.6V on the stock cooler. Your EK blocks should handle that very well.

Keeping them cool is the key, not volts. There has been a paradigm shift with the latest fabrication shrinks (both CPU and GPU) where they aren't as keen on volts as they used to be. I know, with the smaller fab the voltages must go down proportionally but they just seem less tolerant. (My opinion...)

Glad to see you taking the plunge! Ask anything, we're all behind you!

@eidairaman1,

They are for NTSC/PAL selection. No need to futz with them.

[thoughtdisorder]

i know this is out of topic, but yesterday, i had my machine apart for cleaning, i was looking at my 1950 Pro and i noticed 2 DIP switches on it, i wonder what they do.

Sapphire Radeon 1950 Pro AGP.

Some of the X1950 Pro's have jumpers, some have dips. They're for switching the video out / TV signal to PAL or NTSC.

[eidairaman1]

Some of the X1950 Pro's have jumpers, some have dips. They're for switching the video out / TV signal to PAL or NTSC.

where did you get this info from? also i thought standards switching was software based nowadays.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

It should be silkscreened near the switches. They usually have them covered by a yellow/amber colored plastic.

[philbrown23]

so should my H.I.S. be running at 1.9 resistance cuz no matter how many times I do it they both come out the same.

[DanishDevil]

You need to rough up the resistor or area that you will be shading. I had to on my HIS.

[thoughtdisorder]

where did you get this info from? also i thought standards switching was software based nowadays.

I have a 1950 and I asked a dude where I work (Raytheon) who is literally a "rocket scientist" what the deal was, he told me the deal......I messed with it and found he was right.

[thoughtdisorder]

You need to rough up the resistor or area that you will be shading. I had to on my HIS.

+1, Danish is right, rough it up for the best result!:toast:

[DanishDevil]

I used a nail file in the opposite direction that i would be shading, and I shaded the long way. That way, the grooves you create near/in the resistor get filled with lead easier.

When you think about it, many of these tech things really come down to simple mechanics and physics :D

[thoughtdisorder]

I used a nail file in the opposite direction that i would be shading, and I shaded the long way. That way, the grooves you create near/in the resistor get filled with lead easier.

When you think about it, many of these tech things really come down to simple mechanics and physics :D

Great stuff! Danish, you're obviously a dude like me who's done the "trial and error" route!:toast:

(Unfortunately, it's usually my son (RM) who does the trial & error and then hits me up for more money to fix the results!):laugh:

[philbrown23]

ok gotta wait till my new pencils come in no place around here sells the right noes not even the art store, these are drawing pecils we are talking bout yes?

[Random Murderer]

ok gotta wait till my new pencils come in no place around here sells the right noes not even the art store, these are drawing pecils we are talking bout yes?

i used 4h, i can whip out a pencil mod(1.6 or 1.5 K ohms to 1k ohm) in about 5 minutes.

[asb2106]

The red points, yes. I just stick the ground to the case (like where the side panel locks into).

100k ohm trimmer is correct for vCore mod. Also correct on setup. Test trimmer for MAX resistance then tune down (checking voltages as you go).

I don't think OVP kicks in until 1.9V, IIRC. I've had mine to 1.6V on the stock cooler. Your EK blocks should handle that very well.

Keeping them cool is the key, not volts. There has been a paradigm shift with the latest fabrication shrinks (both CPU and GPU) where they aren't as keen on volts as they used to be. I know, with the smaller fab the voltages must go down proportionally but they just seem less tolerant. (My opinion...)

Glad to see you taking the plunge! Ask anything, we're all behind you!

@eidairaman1,

They are for NTSC/PAL selection. No need to futz with them.

so let me see if I got this straight, I just soldier my hot lead to any one of the red points that are used to measure, ground the other side, and start cranking the volts? I was thinking I was gonna have to do some intense soldiering, but those points dont look too bad.

Any ideas where I can get the 100k trimmers? I went to radioshack here and they didnt have any! I used to work there like 8 years ago and we had sooo much of that stuff, I guess they are going away from it. Any links maybe where I can get em??

[thoughtdisorder]

i used 4h, i can whip out a pencil mod(1.6 or 1.5 K ohms to 1k ohm) in about 5 minutes.

+1. Phil, make sure you use the 4h, if you're having trouble locating them, let us know, maybe we can help!:cool:

[Dr. Spankenstein]

so let me see if I got this straight, I just soldier my hot lead to any one of the red points that are used to measure, ground the other side, and start cranking the volts? I was thinking I was gonna have to do some intense soldiering, but those points dont look too bad.

Any ideas where I can get the 100k trimmers? I went to radioshack here and they didnt have any! I used to work there like 8 years ago and we had sooo much of that stuff, I guess they are going away from it. Any links maybe where I can get em??

WHOOPS! HOLD THE PHONE!

My mistake, thanks for verifying. I though your were checking voltages!:eek:
Correction: you will use one of the BLUE points (I actually used the solder pad above the yellow bar-the arrow on the PCB is pointing right at it!) This is the hairiest part of the whole thing, but I chose that point cuz there wasn't much around it to screw up!
The ground I had running to one of the screws holding the mem heatsink on-heck, it's right there!
I'll try to upload a pic of my mod when I get home.

You'll need to verify which legs of the trim pot you want to use. Measure to 100k ohms then do your thing.

I've got a few leftovers that are perfectly fine. Shoot me a PM and we'll get them out to you.

[asb2106]

WHOOPS! HOLD THE PHONE!

My mistake, thanks for verifying. I though your were checking voltages!:eek:
Correction: you will use one of the BLUE points (I actually used the solder pad above the yellow bar-the arrow on the PCB is pointing right at it!) This is the hairiest part of the whole thing, but I chose that point cuz there wasn't much around it to screw up!
The ground I had running to one of the screws holding the mem heatsink on-heck, it's right there!
I'll try to upload a pic of my mod when I get home.

You'll need to verify which legs of the trim pot you want to use. Measure to 100k ohms then do your thing.

I've got a few leftovers that are perfectly fine. Shoot me a PM and we'll get them out to you.

ok, I am ordering another pump and radiator on monday, so I can make a sperate loop for my CPU. Since it will be apart already I figure thats the best time to do it! Im gonna take some pics of the video cards and put them up here later this week. The cards dont look the same as the other cards here. It could be because Im looking at it upside down.

About the trimmers Ill shoot u over a message tommorow, Im hitting the sack right now. Thanks for all your help Dr., youve always been a big help.

**ALSO

did you see my post in the 3dmark ATI forum, please take a look, Im having issues with my xfire!

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Just saw it. Get some sleep, we'll tawk latah!

[Dr. Spankenstein]

BTW here's that pic I promised:

http://img.techpowerup.org/080406/HardMod.jpg

[Random Murderer]

nice work!

[Cold Storm]

Dr. Spankenstein, you did a awesome job at reworking the wires! Probably the cleanest mod done yet with the trim pots.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Thank you!

I HATE messy vmods! This was my very first one, so I took my time. Thought about the layout and the cleanest method.

Nice to be appreciated!

[Cold Storm]

Time is what makes perfect in all forms of life. I've found that, like you have done, is by having the clearest of mind sets you can oc anything. But doing it while you are hungry, tired, or just plain in lala land.
And, your welcome for that. By being clean, you also can tell how the mod is being done!

[eidairaman1]

+1, Danish is right, rough it up for the best result!:toast:
that or use a conductive pen, but prewarning you could make that permanent and not beable to restore it, sometimes i think its better to have a variable resistor so you can control the voltage yourself.

[eidairaman1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resistor

btw good reference for SMT resistors, for relative values

[DanishDevil]

that or use a conductive pen, but prewarning you could make that permanent and not beable to restore it, sometimes i think its better to have a variable resistor so you can control the voltage yourself.

Do NOT use a conductive pen. It will will work. That shorts the resistor completely. Our mod is meant to be able to control the amount of resistance, not bypass it.

We discussed it a few pages back in this thread...

[Cold Storm]

Even if you want a perm. mod with this. Nail polish will work wonders. Non conductive..

[DanishDevil]

Have you seen any drop in voltage after the nail polish Cold Storm?

Hehe I should pick out a pretty color to match the PCB :D

[Cold Storm]

lol.. I don't have the card anymore. I gave it RM as a Christmas/Birthday present. He's helped me out a lot since I got back into this. So, I wanted to do something nice.
So I haven't done that. But, I believe Sneeky 100% on anything, so I go with that.

[DanishDevil]

Sweet! Once I get my Diamond 3870, I'll have to try it out.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Do NOT use a conductive pen. It will will work. That shorts the resistor completely. Our mod is meant to be able to control the amount of resistance, not bypass it.

We discussed it a few pages back in this thread...

...and it got shot down JUST as fast!

@eidairaman1,

Why would you post bad info twice?:shadedshu

[Cold Storm]

Once RM gets mine in his system, and redid the pencil mod, I'll see if we can talk him into it.. The card doesn't have a warr. anymore, so I don't think he'll say no... lol

[eidairaman1]

hence why i put the warning lable on it.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Quite...

"You could fire the shotgun at the intended target, or discharge it directly into your face. Be warned that the second option may not be reversable!"

Thanks for the disclaimer!:laugh:

[DanishDevil]

Hey guys. Trying to trade my HIS for Freaksavior's RMA'd Diamond.

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l294/freaksavior/3870001.jpg

I don't see an R1222. It looks like a totally different resistor pattern.

1: Is this pencil and/or voltmoddable, and by what methods?
2: Is this good for software voltage control?

[freaksavior]

yeah, anybody know?

[erocker]

Hey guys. Trying to trade my HIS for Freaksavior's RMA'd Diamond.

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l294/freaksavior/3870001.jpg

I don't see an R1222. It looks like a totally different resistor pattern.

1: Is this pencil and/or voltmoddable, and by what methods?
2: Is this good for software voltage control?

The card in the pic does not support software voltage control. See attatchment.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

R1222 is clearly labled. Unfortunately, it's not there!

http://img.techpowerup.org/080409/Correct.jpg

[erocker]

R1222 is clearly labled.


Unfortunately, it is oriented vertically=no software voltage control.:(

I beleive you are looking at the wrong resistor for software control, the pic I posted before you;), shows the correct resistor. Unless both of them can determine software control?

[DanishDevil]

Oh wow I totally thought it was to the left of the label R684. Kinda hard to tell when you haven't seen that end of your 3870 for a few weeks :D

Thanks guys.

PS: erocker he was saying for the pencilmod...

Right?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

I beleive you are looking at the wrong resistor for software control, the pic I posted before you;), shows the correct resistor. Unless both of them can determine software control?



How wierd that we did almost the exact same crop?:D

[philbrown23]

my cards pecilmod quite nicely! but one of them is no longer functioning correcly! RMA time!

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Actually we were both wrong!

I corrected my image above!

[Cold Storm]

what do you mean isn't working right?
check to see about the mod it self?

[DanishDevil]

SEE MY PM! DON'T RMA!!!

Also, thanks for looking at it again guys. Looks like I'm on the lookout for another red 3870...

[erocker]

Actually we were both wrong!

I corrected my image above!

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=53220 W1zzard thinks I'm right!:p

[Dr. Spankenstein]

O.K., then we're both RIGHT!

I thought they were asking for the resistor to shade for pencil mod (R1222). My pic. It's not there!

The one you highlighted determines of software voltage control is possible. It's vertical.

...so there!:p

[DanishDevil]

Hmm. Maybe I'll have freaksavior try software voltage with the latest atitools...

Anyone try it yet? (without an already voltmodded card) LMAO

[erocker]

Beta 4 gave me a bunch of lockups.

[stupidbiznitch9]

y dont u all just tape off the areas you don't want to touch..........and if you hand slips OOPS oh god good thing i had tape there LOL!!!

[Random Murderer]

Hey guys. Trying to trade my HIS for Freaksavior's RMA'd Diamond.

I don't see an R1222. It looks like a totally different resistor pattern.

1: Is this pencil and/or voltmoddable, and by what methods?
2: Is this good for software voltage control?

no software voltage control, but it is pencil moddable using the other pencil mod, the one where you connect the two solder points.

[DanishDevil]

Just to make sure, how about this one?

R1222 is right there, but no software voltage control, right?

[cdawall]

needs a better pic DD

[DanishDevil]

That's the best I can get...

[cdawall]

select portrait on your camera it should work better for up close shots

[Random Murderer]

Just to make sure, how about this one?

R1222 is right there, but no software voltage control, right?

that one has software control.

[DanishDevil]

Not my card, not my camera.

It does??? Ok sweet. It's a GeCube, and the cooler is pure reference. It should hopefully be a pure reference card!

[Cold Storm]

The Gecube 3870 is the one that RM now owns of mine... I some what miss that card..

[DanishDevil]

Ooh sweet! Ok good news, then.

[cdawall]

this is a pic i stole from w1z but anyway its the same as the back of my OEM 3850 256mb

http://img.techpowerup.org/080221/Capture1402.jpg

and some that i took

http://img.techpowerup.org/080412/Image1.png

http://img.techpowerup.org/080412/3850 004.jpg

i use the first guide right?

[DanishDevil]

Nope. That's a different resistor.

On the 3870s anyway, R1222 is the one to shade for the pencil mod. The vertical/horizontal resistor determines whether or not you have software voltage control.

PS: A scanner actually works very well for pics of the backs of cards.

[cdawall]

hmmm really i used a scanner for cpus but not cards

[DC]

hello my friends... i need your help here and now:(

i can't find a volmod guide for asus radeon 3870 (it's own pcb made by asus makes me angry). Can anyone give me some info?

[DanishDevil]

If you post a picture of the back side of the voltage regulators, like the pictures cdawall posted, then RandomMurderer will take a look.

[Random Murderer]

If you post a picture of the back side of the voltage regulators, like the pictures cdawall posted, then RandomMurderer will take a look.

yep.

[DavyGT]

I got an ASUS EAH3850 512mb. The problem is that the resistance on the card never changes, always staying at 2.28ohm (20k setting) or 1983 (2000setting) on my DMM, whether I use a 2B to 6H pencil. :confused:
I done this when the card was in my case and power is unplugged. What am I doing wrong?

[DanishDevil]

Scratch up the resistor CAREFULLY with a nail file.

Let's say this is the resistor:

__
| |
| |
---

File it horizontally, to get past the stuff they coat the cards with. Don't file it a whole lot. Your goal is to rough up the surface, and reach the metal on the resistor so lead can fall into the grooves you create.

Then, pencil the resistor with vertical strokes. You are essentially creating trenches for your graphite soldiers to bunker in to defeat the resistance. ATi Guerilla Warfare anyone? :roll:

[DavyGT]

Oh! So I skipped a step that wasn't there! Ok I'll try it. :roll:
Cheers mate. :toast:

[DanishDevil]

Cheers DavyGT.

That was my own idea when I was doing it, and I don't know if I ever posted that here...but it helped me get the resistance down a WHOLE lot.

I'm going to be making a how-to video of the pencil mod soon, so stay keep an eye out!

[DavyGT]

Is transistor C664 important? I broke it off when I moved my HDD to another slot. :banghead:
Should I sticky tape back on?
The perils of getting a medium tower case I guess.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Man, I HAVE to hold my tongue right now....

Someone else tell him about AS epoxy before I explode!

[DavyGT]

Noted. Thanks for implying the answer to my question. For now though, I just sticky taped it back on.
I'll fix it when I get the chance.

[eidairaman1]

if you dont get the contacts right on spot you could do more damage than good, and with epoxy on the board you will not be able to RMA it due to that Modification.

Your better off to RMA the board.

[DanishDevil]

Yeah after breaking off something, I would RMA. I've seen so many 3870s RMA'd it's ridiculous.

I almost RMA'd mine because I thought I killed it (didn't break anything off though), but I did a COMPLETE rubdown with cotton balls and lots of 70% isopropyl alcohol, popped it in, and saved it.

[eidairaman1]

probably had some anti-corrosive chemical on it for shipping.

[DC]

http://img360.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sn2000802rb7.jpg

http://razerdeck.free.fr/JMH/photos/3870benji/SN200081.JPG

http://razerdeck.free.fr/JMH/photos/3870benji/SN200094.JPG

eh... thanks in advance, mates...

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Looks pretty barren...

I don't see any provision for a pencil mod on your card. I may be wrong though.

Someone see something that I don't?

[DanishDevil]

I don't know anything about this kinda stuff, but it looks like the area we would focus on with his card would be right behind the 6-Pin power connector. I see the same square chip that we do on the back side of ours...

[SpookyWillow]

http://img360.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sn2000802rb7.jpg

http://razerdeck.free.fr/JMH/photos/3870benji/SN200081.JPG

http://razerdeck.free.fr/JMH/photos/3870benji/SN200094.JPG

eh... thanks in advance, mates...


no mod has been found for that card yet, its an asus one isn't it?

[DC]

yes, it is... i tried playing with pencil at the back of the card with the points that could be ones i needed... but no success yet((( i'm very upset

[SpookyWillow]

this is the closest i've seen yet on that card, nobody seems to be able to get the required pdf's for the asus cards.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2880403&postcount=670

[DC]

i've even written to asus... waiting for reply... but i think it's useless

[CBOT]

Here the New Version of PowerColor HD3870 512MB GDDR3 FP Edition.

No R1222.

http://www.abload.de/thumb/dsc0393007n.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=dsc0393007n.jpg)

[Random Murderer]

Here the New Version of PowerColor HD3870 512MB GDDR3 FP Edition.

No R1222.

http://www.abload.de/thumb/dsc0393007n.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=dsc0393007n.jpg)

shade the resistor i covered in green. i don't know values, but this should work.

[DavyGT]

Is 88*C hot for a 3850/70? That is the load temperature after 1hour of ATitool. I managed to reduce resistance from 2.40 to 1.80 and will push more from my 3850 512mb if it isn't too hot.
Strangely enough, some pencils aren't good at reducing resistance. I only managed to lower the voltage from a Faber Castell 2B. My 4B, 4H, 6H didn't work and only increased resistance. :confused:
Also, I know that I'm going to approach the 860mhz barrier if I keep going. There isn't an ASUS 3850 512mb .71 BIOS in the repository and I tried (literally) every BIOS in the repository. And everyone of them, except for the ASUS ones, didn't work, throwing up a subset systems mismatch. What can I do now? More importantly, how did you crossflash it to another manufacturer?

[CBOT]

shade the resistor i covered in green. i don't know values, but this should work.

thx.
But no Voltage change when i Pencil.

[Random Murderer]

thx.
But no Voltage change when i Pencil.

what is the default resistance?
how far did you drop the resistance?

[DanishDevil]

thx.
But no Voltage change when i Pencil.

You might need to rough up the area with a nail file or something similar. Do you see the coating over the card that kind of looks like clear nail polish or something? That could be preventing you from reaching the metal contacts and getting any voltage change.

RM: If this helps, it would be the 3rd or 4th time it's helped, and maybe you could add it as a tip to the first post?

[Random Murderer]

You might need to rough up the area with a nail file or something similar. Do you see the coating over the card that kind of looks like clear nail polish or something? That could be preventing you from reaching the metal contacts and getting any voltage change.

RM: If this helps, it would be the 3rd or 4th time it's helped, and maybe you could add it as a tip to the first post?

will do.

[CBOT]

what is the default resistance?
how far did you drop the resistance?

Hehe i have no Idea :rockout:

No Voltage Controll Hardware here so i make it with Luck:) when the Card Die i buy a new one.

@DanishDevil
Thx. i will do this and Test it Card PCB was really dirty.


Edit: I think my Bios is Locked 864Mhz dont work but 850Mhz runs fine.
Voltage change on Bios from 1,214 to 1,274 gives me higher Temps befor 37C idle now 48C idle and Pencil the same but no more Mhz will go .I think bios was Locked, no the Problem is i have a GDDR3 3870 and i found no unlocked bios for my Card.
So can i Flash a Unlocked 3850 Bios with Samsung 1ns Ram to Unlock them?

http://gpuz.techpowerup.com/08/05/09/8hu.png

[DavyGT]

Edit: I think my Bios is Locked 864Mhz dont work but 850Mhz runs fine.
Voltage change on Bios from 1,214 to 1,274 gives me higher Temps befor 37C idle now 48C idle and Pencil the same but no more Mhz will go .I think bios was Locked, no the Problem is i have a GDDR3 3870 and i found no unlocked bios for my Card.
So can i Flash a Unlocked 3850 Bios with Samsung 1ns Ram to Unlock them?


I don't think you should. I mean, I don't know what's stopping you from flashing it to a 3850, but I just... wouldn't do that.
What's your max temp?

[DC]

so.. no ideas about asus 3870?(

[Random Murderer]

so.. no ideas about asus 3870?(

no, asus has decided to use proprietary parts, so until an asus rep wants to tell us the pinout of those parts, we're screwed.

[DC]

hm... and no ideas how i can make to become a Columbus? O_o ... i can check any variants...

[Random Murderer]

hm... and no ideas how i can make to become a Columbus? O_o ... i can check any variants...

no, you don't understand: there is absolutely NO data on the parts they use...

[DanishDevil]

Ok guys, I started to pencil this new 3870 (Built by ATi under the GeCube brand name) and my first step was to flash to the BIOS attached, which is the newest (0.79) for the Built By ATi cards.

Stock resistance was 1.62, with 3D voltages of 1.34V.

My first pencil got me .8 resistance, with 3D voltages of 1.44V. I set the fan to 100%, added a 120mm and 92mm of my own, and it was time to begin testing.

Since I got just over 864 before the penciling (after the flash to get rid of that bug) I tried for 904.5. Seemed to work like a charm giving me 3383 fur marks with memory at stock. Then, I bumped to 918, and ran again. My score was less than before. I thought, hmm...wtf...

I checked the hardware monitoring, and saw this:

http://img.techpowerup.org/080512/Wtf....jpg

It's tough to see, but once it went into 3D mode, the core dropped to 864 and it ran the benchmark. I disabled OCing (the drop to 224), reenabled, and set for 914 again, and as you can see, it dropped me again to 864.

Has anyone seen/experienced this before? If you take a look at the bios in RBE, it's 3D clocks are set to the 777 stock speeds, so it didn't kick them down because of that, and besides, Rivatuner should be overriding that anyway.

Thanks in advance for the help guys!

[DanishDevil]

I just upped my PCI-E clock to 115MHz and it fixed my problem. Thanks to fit! :rockout:

Trying to get 945 core stable!

[Wile E]

Ok guys, I started to pencil this new 3870 (Built by ATi under the GeCube brand name) and my first step was to flash to the BIOS attached, which is the newest (0.79) for the Built By ATi cards.

Stock resistance was 1.62, with 3D voltages of 1.34V.

My first pencil got me .8 resistance, with 3D voltages of 1.44V. I set the fan to 100%, added a 120mm and 92mm of my own, and it was time to begin testing.

Since I got just over 864 before the penciling (after the flash to get rid of that bug) I tried for 904.5. Seemed to work like a charm giving me 3383 fur marks with memory at stock. Then, I bumped to 918, and ran again. My score was less than before. I thought, hmm...wtf...

I checked the hardware monitoring, and saw this:

http://img.techpowerup.org/080512/Wtf....jpg

It's tough to see, but once it went into 3D mode, the core dropped to 864 and it ran the benchmark. I disabled OCing (the drop to 224), reenabled, and set for 914 again, and as you can see, it dropped me again to 864.

Has anyone seen/experienced this before? If you take a look at the bios in RBE, it's 3D clocks are set to the 777 stock speeds, so it didn't kick them down because of that, and besides, Rivatuner should be overriding that anyway.

Thanks in advance for the help guys!Something similar to that happens to me with my 8800GT in 3DMark05. I just said "eff" it, and flashed the card to the clocks I was trying to get Riva to use. Then I flashed it back to stock when done. lol.

[DanishDevil]

Haha nice. Looks like the PCI-E clock helped it for me.

[dark2099]

So I am trying to mod my VisionTek 3870 (just one for now, only have the 1 TT Duo Orb) but it seems the R1222 Resistor isn't there or something so I can't measure the resistance.

http://www.prairiejoes.com/tpu/vmod.jpg

Picture of the whole area (huge pic)

http://www.prairiejoes.com/tpu/backside3.jpg

[dark2099]

Sorry to double post but no one can help me?

[DanishDevil]

You do not have an R1222. That means that you will have to try the second pencil mod, in yellow:

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/4182/hd3870pmodsl4.png

I haven't tried it. I'm going to with this card, though.

[eidairaman1]

so where is the first mod again, because there is a possibility there may have been a overlook of the resistor, also not all boards are designed the same, for all we know the specific resistor can be located somewhere else.

[dark2099]

Ok, now I just need to get my DMM to read the resistance.
Pic of my DMM, if you can see can you tell me which resistance setting to use?

http://www.homeandbeyond.com/prod-0053450-zoom.html

[DanishDevil]

If memory serves me right, 20k ohms for resistance (bottom left section), and 20 under the V with 3 dots and a line (top left section) for voltage.

I would try the second one, but wait for Random Murderer to look at your card to see if there's another mod. I'll send him a PM.

[eidairaman1]

well if your shooting for resistance, use the Ohms, but if your shooting for Voltage, use the VDC Setting, Never Shoot Resistance with power applied, you can smoke the meter doing that or even damage the component your shooting.

[dark2099]

Well I set it to the 200 setting for Resistance and touch the black cable to a metal part on my pc, and the red to the area I am supposed to test and the display shows nothing.

[eidairaman1]

your not shooting it right.

[dark2099]

Ok, so that confused me even more (no offense) but what exactly does that mean, and how do I shoot it properly?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Danish had it right.
If you are trying to measure voltages, set the DMM to 20V (~10:30 position).
For resistance set your DMM to the 20k Ohm (~7 o'clock position).

If you are checking resistance, you will want to toch the leads to either end of the resistor you are checking. The proceedure you outlined 2 posts up is for checking voltages.

Be careful and make double-sure what you are doing around these sensitive components.

Many a brave card has given their lives needlessly in the name of fumbled DMM explorations...

[eidairaman1]

never Shoot Ohms (Ω) with Power Applied, you will kill the Meter and possibly the component your shooting, shoot only voltage with power applied also make sure its set to DC and not AC (~)

[dark2099]

Danish had it right.
If you are trying to measure voltages, set the DMM to 20V (~10:30 position).
For resistance set your DMM to the 20k Ohm (~7 o'clock position).

If you are checking resistance, you will want to toch the leads to either end of the resistor you are checking. The proceedure you outlined 2 posts up is for checking voltages.

Be careful and make double-sure what you are doing around these sensitive components.

Many a brave card has given their lives needlessly in the name of fumbled DMM explorations...

When you say touc the leads to either end of the resistor what exactly do you mean, like where do I touch the negative lead and where do I touch the positive lead?

[Random Murderer]

You do not have an R1222. That means that you will have to try the second pencil mod, in yellow:

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/4182/hd3870pmodsl4.png

I haven't tried it. I'm going to with this card, though.

he's exactly right. you have no r1222, so you're only option for penciling is to do the second mod.
if you want, you can just do the solder mod.

[dark2099]

I realize that the 2nd is my only option, I currently am having difficulties getting my DMM to properly read the resistance from that measuring point.

[Random Murderer]

I realize that the 2nd is my only option, I currently am having difficulties getting my DMM to properly read the resistance from that measuring point.

set it to 25k ohms.

[dark2099]

Can I use the 20k setting (I don't have a 25k setting), and how should I have the leads, the negative touching a metal part of the case while using the positive to measure, or....

[Random Murderer]

Can I use the 20k setting (I don't have a 25k setting), and how should I have the leads, the negative touching a metal part of the case while using the positive to measure, or....

20k, yes. you should use the lowest setting that is still higher that what the resistor is. to read the resistance, touch one lead to one point and the other lead to the other point.

[DanishDevil]

Use the 20k settings. Let me snap a few pics of the proper way...

[eidairaman1]

yet its silk screened on there, thats very odd.

[DanishDevil]

yet its silk screened on there, thats very odd.

What's silkscreened?

[dark2099]

I think I figured it out (but will recheck after you post pics Danish). The readout was 2.36 if that sounds normal.

[eidairaman1]

So I am trying to mod my VisionTek 3870 (just one for now, only have the 1 TT Duo Orb) but it seems the R1222 Resistor isn't there or something so I can't measure the resistance.

http://www.prairiejoes.com/tpu/vmod.jpg

Picture of the whole area (huge pic)

http://www.prairiejoes.com/tpu/backside3.jpg

This Image he posted has the R1222 Resistor Silk Screen but for position i cant see it, very fuzzy.

[DanishDevil]

This is how you test resistance:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2847.JPG

(Note: The orientation of the red and black contacts does not matter when measuring resistance.)

And here is how to measure the resistance of R1222:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2844.JPG

Closeup:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2846.JPG

You want each tip to be in contact with the metal part of the resistor on each end. That way, a small current generated by your DMM passes through the resistor from tip to tip, and the DMM measures the resistance.

Here is how to measure the resistance of the second pencil mod:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2849.JPG

Closeup:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2850.JPG

This one's simple. Touch each tip to each metal dot, and read your DMM.

Here is how you measure voltage:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2848.JPG

Hope this helps! I plan on doing a full walkthrough on TechFuzion sometime soon.

[DanishDevil]

This Image he posted has the R1222 Resistor Silk Screen but for position i cant see it, very fuzzy.

Ok gotcha. Well they probably had some PCBs left over and decided to change the component layout. Silly companies trying to keep us from drawing on our video cards :roll:

[eidairaman1]

they probably view that resistor as not needed.

[dark2099]

Thanks for all your help guys. :respect:

[eidairaman1]

Ok gotcha. Well they probably had some PCBs left over and decided to change the component layout. Silly companies trying to keep us from drawing on our video cards :roll:

I wonder if the 3850 Is Volt Moddable.

[thoughtdisorder]

This is how you test resistance:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2847.JPG

(Note: The orientation of the red and black contacts does not matter when measuring resistance.)

And here is how to measure the resistance of R1222:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2844.JPG

Closeup:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2846.JPG

You want each tip to be in contact with the metal part of the resistor on each end. That way, a small current generated by your DMM passes through the resistor from tip to tip, and the DMM measures the resistance.

Here is how to measure the resistance of the second pencil mod:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2849.JPG

Closeup:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2850.JPG

This one's simple. Touch each tip to each metal dot, and read your DMM.

Here is how you measure voltage:

http://techfuzion.net/DanishDevil/PencilMod/CIMG2848.JPG

Hope this helps! I plan on doing a full walkthrough on TechFuzion sometime soon.

Nice work Danish, THANKS!:toast:

[DanishDevil]

No problem guys.

What do you think, a how-to video or a photo walkthrough would be better? The video won't be as clear, but it will show process a little easier than photos.

[thoughtdisorder]

I wonder if the 3850 Is Volt Moddable.

I would think so, I mean it only seems logical. Randoms working a double tomorrow, and he's now sleeping, but I plan on asking him when he gets home tomorrow night.

[DanishDevil]

I wonder if the 3850 Is Volt Moddable.

Same thing as this 3870 guys, except the resistances and voltages are different.

[thoughtdisorder]

No problem guys.

What do you think, a how-to video or a photo walkthrough would be better? The video won't be as clear, but it will show process a little easier than photos.

Video would be good, but overall I would think pics would help the inexperienced more, just my 2 cents.........

[thoughtdisorder]

Same thing as this 3870 guys, except the resistances and voltages are different.

That makes perfect sense.....:cool:

[dark2099]

Ok, I don't know what I'm doing wrong now, but I shade in the area slightly, test the resistance, and it either hasn't changed, so I shade a little more, and still not change in the resistance.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

If you are shading the area indicated by the yellow line in the image provided by DanishDevil, you might need to slightly scratch the surface of the PCB in order for the graphite to adhere.

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/4182/hd3870pmodsl4.png[/IMG]

There is a coating on the PCB that will hinder the shading from "sticking". When you get ready to power-up the first time, be ready to test for voltages as this can be rather unrefined in it's ability to adjust the amount of resistance drop.

[dark2099]

Ah, I switched to using a 4B pencil rather than 4H and it seemed to work better, should I erase the 4B and retry with the 4H?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Up to you. Softer only equals, easier to lay down a good trace of graphite.

But when it comes to this particular Ghetto mod, it make little difference.

[dark2099]

I think I might not do this after all, got the resistance down to 2.15 from 2.37, voltage is at 1.48 up from 1.34, and ATI tool doesn't want to OC the card now (course I am on a fresh install of Vista 64)

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Why! That's a respectable voltage, just dump ATITool and get RivaTuner. You be able to OC and control the fan. Heck, you could even go to *looks around for ATITool agents*, ATI Tray Tools!

[dark2099]

Hehe, yea, just gave RivaTuner a test and worked just fine, only when I started scanning for artifacts at clocks I had before doing the mod, I was getting lots of artifacts where as before the mod I wouldn't. Should I use something else for artifact scanning?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

No real reason to.

I WOULD suggest that you kick the fan speed to 100% until you get a grasp of what's going on with your new voltages AND clock speeds.

To me, these smaller GPUs are more sensetive to heat than previous fabrications.

[dark2099]

Well on the card I am doing the mod right now I have a ThermalTake DuoOrb w/ the goo it came with, hopefully my MX-2 will get here monday, when I will get another TT DuoOrb for my 2nd card and play with that one.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Cool, keep us posted of your progress!

And congrats on having the nuggets to go ahead and pencil-mod that sucker!

[dark2099]

Long story short, I picked up a cheap AMD mobo & cpu combo cause it was about that time, knew AMD's were generally easier to OC (or thought atleast when I got it) slowly upgraded parts, and now have become a chronic benchmarker and want to get an Intel setup to improve the current high scores.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

NOW yer talkin'!!

Until AMD comes up with a stunner, you will shit bricks when you work with and Intel CPU.

'Nuff said...

[thoughtdisorder]

NOW yer talkin'!!

Until AMD comes up with a stunner, you will shit bricks when you work with and Intel CPU.

'Nuff said...

So fuc*ing eloquent! I Love you man! :toast:

[Wile E]

NOW yer talkin'!!

Until AMD comes up with a stunner, you will shit bricks when you work with and Intel CPU.

'Nuff said...

Yep. I'm glad I made the switch. Benchmarking has never been so fun, now that I can actually compete in the upper tiers.

[DanishDevil]

Same here. 4.68GHz on water is really nothing to sneeze at! My E6300 @ 1.86GHz felt faster than my 5000+BE @ 3.2GHz.

[Wile E]

Same here. 4.68GHz on water is really nothing to sneeze at! My E6300 @ 1.86GHz felt faster than my 5000+BE @ 3.2GHz.

Is that 24/7 clocks at those voltages, or just bench settings?

[DanishDevil]

Well that was temporarily benching to make sure I wasn't trading away the better E8500 :roll:

SuperPi attached. How I want to break 10s... :banghead:

[Wile E]

Well that was temporarily benching to make sure I wasn't trading away the better E8500 :roll:

SuperPi attached. How I want to break 10s... :banghead:

Moar voltage!!!!!!!

[DanishDevil]

I know. I tried once with my old chip all the way up to 1.61V after vdroop and the chip did NOT like it even though temps never got over 54C. Hopefully this one likes the juice :D

[Wile E]

Mine doesn't, but I don't care, so I make it run. lol.

[philbrown23]

ok so can both mods be used at the same time? like the blue pencil and the yellow pencil? would it yeild better results?

[Random Murderer]

ok so can both mods be used at the same time? like the blue pencil and the yellow pencil? would it yeild better results?

yes, but if it can be avoided, don't use both.
since the second mod lowers resistance so easily, you can use that one if you want "extreme" voltage, but used in conjunction with the other one, the over current protection and over voltage protection will kick in.
there is a way around this, but it requires removing parts from the pcb.

[theorw]

Hi!I am new here...Anyway, i had a powercolor 3870 that i had voltmoded with 2nd mod and i had achieved 935-1251 for 24/7.Unfortunatelly, i gave it to a friend for some days and the card died...
The shop i bought it replaced it with sapphire 3870 toxic.I was wondering if someone has voltmoded the toxic version cos the blue pcb is different than the red one.(even from the atomic who also has the red)
So has anyone done that???

[Random Murderer]

Hi!I am new here...Anyway, i had a powercolor 3870 that i had voltmoded with 2nd mod and i had achieved 935-1251 for 24/7.Unfortunatelly, i gave it to a friend for some days and the card died...
The shop i bought it replaced it with sapphire 3870 toxic.I was wondering if someone has voltmoded the toxic version cos the blue pcb is different than the red one.(even from the atomic who also has the red)
So has anyone done that???

welcome!

to answer your question, no, not that i've heard. if you can get some clear pics of both sides of the card, i'll see what i can do. since sapphire is not known to use proprietary parts(like asus) i should be able to figure something out for you :toast:

[theorw]

Ok really thanks man.I am waiting to call me for recieving the card today or tommorow so with the help of my cybershot ill post u the pics.Cooler removed of course right?

[Random Murderer]

yes. most likely after the first few shots, i will ask for a zoomed in shot of a few specific parts of the card.

[theorw]

Ok dont worry my camera has GREAT micro capabilities!!I am disappointed though...Only 2 phase power while the reference pcb has 4!!!What were they thinking?That we would overclock???!!!
Anyway crapy pcb but i hope u find the voltmod!
as soon as i get the card i ll post the pics and anything u need.

[DanishDevil]

Just checking in with a quick question - 3870x2 is hard mod only, correct? I snagged a Sapphire with an EK Full Cover Block off [H] for a steal :D

[Random Murderer]

Just checking in with a quick question - 3870x2 is hard mod only, correct? I snagged a Sapphire with an EK Full Cover Block off [H] for a steal :D

afaik it's hard mod only.

[DavyGT]

I'd like to ask a question. How much faster are the overclocked cards then the stock cards in real games? Say compare between stock 3870 and 1ghz OC. Would it make a big difference, or are we talking 2-5 more frames?
I'm not doubting the pencil mod, just questoning whether the gains are worth the trouble. Or is it exclusively for bragging rights?

[Viilutaja]

I would say, that in Crysis , U get @ least 8-10 fps more compared 1GHZ vs Stock.

[Random Murderer]

I'd like to ask a question. How much faster are the overclocked cards then the stock cards in real games? Say compare between stock 3870 and 1ghz OC. Would it make a big difference, or are we talking 2-5 more frames?
I'm not doubting the pencil mod, just questoning whether the gains are worth the trouble. Or is it exclusively for bragging rights?

it actually helps dramatically with gaming. i don't have an exact figure, but i'd guess that it's about 10-15 fps gain, depending on your resolution.

[DavyGT]

I'm seeing alot of artifacts after the volt mod. I didn't file down the resistor as there was no need to. I removed it now and changed coolers. I'll try a BIOS flash if these artifacts keep occuring. Not looking good for the Radeon... (RMA)

[DanishDevil]

Don't RMA it so fast. Take the cooler and all the stickers off (take pictures of where the stickers go so you can put them back for RMA if needed) and get a bottle of 70% or higher concentration of isopropyl alcohol (if you don't have any, head to your local pharmacy) and some cotton balls. Give the entire card an alcohol rub-down, while being careful to watch components like resistors and capacitors (don't break them off). Just dabbing them with the alcohol-soaked cotton swab is enough. Then dab it dry with more swabs, and let it air-dry for about an hour (alcohol evaporates much faster than water). Then, put everything back on, and try to boot up. It saved my seemingly-dead HIS 3870 a few months back.

If not, RMA that sucker, and better luck next time!

[DanishDevil]

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Powercolor/HD_4850/images/back_full.jpg

^^ 4850. Go RM Go!

[tigger]

Heres what i reckon,

http://img.techpowerup.org/080619/vmod.jpg

Its very similar to a 3850

[asb2106]

I would say, that in Crysis , U get @ least 8-10 fps more compared 1GHZ vs Stock.

This is a fact, I wish I still had the screenies, they are somewhere on TPU,

I ran a bunch of tests on Crysis 64bit DX10 with a sapphire 3870 at stock speeds, and also at 875, 950, & 1Ghz.

I have 2 hard-mod 3870 sapphire toxics that have been great to me :)

A couple months back I was able to get one card to 1147mhz.

The difference in crysis was definitly noticable, all tests were run at 1920x1200, and as the speeds went up so did the frames. I cant remember exactly, but there was a difference of 8 frames from a 1ghz to stock. My best and most consistent results actually came from 950, I got 15 more FPS on average, and it was the STABLE as a rock. the memory on the card plays a huge role in frames at 1920x1200 also. The highest I could bump the memory was 1256, but it made a difference of 6 frames itself :)

Mods are cool, but since I stopped benching about 2 months ago I have not even touched the voltage regulators I have on the cards. I probably will never do it again

[Random Murderer]

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Powercolor/HD_4850/images/back_full.jpg

^^ 4850. Go RM Go!

i'll hop to it when i get a break from my job...

[tomcug]

What's the maximum safe voltage for Hynix 1.4ns GDDR3 memory chips?

[DanishDevil]

Heres what i reckon,

http://img.techpowerup.org/080619/vmod.jpg

Its very similar to a 3850

I'll let someone else try it first :rolleyes:

[tigger]

If you check on XS,jimmyz has done the vmod for the 4850,the vmod points he's using are the same as the vmod points i marked.Dunno about the pencil mod point i marked tho'.

[DavyGT]

Don't RMA it so fast. Take the cooler and all the stickers off (take pictures of where the stickers go so you can put them back for RMA if needed) and get a bottle of 70% or higher concentration of isopropyl alcohol (if you don't have any, head to your local pharmacy) and some cotton balls. Give the entire card an alcohol rub-down, while being careful to watch components like resistors and capacitors (don't break them off). Just dabbing them with the alcohol-soaked cotton swab is enough. Then dab it dry with more swabs, and let it air-dry for about an hour (alcohol evaporates much faster than water). Then, put everything back on, and try to boot up. It saved my seemingly-dead HIS 3870 a few months back.

If not, RMA that sucker, and better luck next time!

That seemed to have fixed it! It did have have some issues with the artifacturing in ATiTool but that was at stock speed. Strangely, if I underclock it to 533mhz or 688mhz, it's fine but not at stock.
The cleaning gave the card an overclocking comeback- it managed 769mhz on stock cooling, no pencil mod, @75C, though I think the drivers had something to do with it as well (8.6). I will let it artifact test overnight to see if it is stable. Formerly, it struggled to do 700mhz.

[DanishDevil]

That seemed to have fixed it! It did have have some issues with the artifacturing in ATiTool but that was at stock speed. Strangely, if I underclock it to 533mhz or 688mhz, it's fine but not at stock.
The cleaning gave the card an overclocking comeback- it managed 769mhz on stock cooling, no pencil mod, @75C, though I think the drivers had something to do with it as well (8.6). I will let it artifact test overnight to see if it is stable. Formerly, it struggled to do 700mhz.

Woohoo! Another card brought back from the grave! :toast:

Glad I could help :rockout:

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Glad to have been of help.;)

[8bit_terror]

I have read the thread and no one mentioned anything about the compatability of the bioses with asus platform. My card is ASUS EAH3870 TOP ediotion and there is no much time since i have a lot of problems with it coused by unproper bioses, in that time i used ones dropped by you and the result was that in post system informs me that the power cable is turned off which was not true. Well now I am with ver010.078........here's it http://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/10124/Asus.HD3870.512.080121.html
and there are no problems even though i was able to clock th gpu to 864 and the ram to 1260. My question is if there will be problems to overclock my gpu beyond 864 after the MOD and if yes where i could provide myself with the unlocked and proper asus bios from or how could i mod the existing bios to clear this 864 border. Thank you! :)

[thoughtdisorder]

I have read the thread and no one mentioned anything about the compatability of the bioses with asus platform. My card is ASUS EAH3870 TOP ediotion and there is no much time since i have a lot of problems with it coused by unproper bioses, in that time i used ones dropped by you and the result was that in post system informs me that the power cable is turned off which was not true. Well now I am with ver010.078........here's it http://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/10124/Asus.HD3870.512.080121.html
and there are no problems even though i was able to clock th gpu to 864 and the ram to 1260. My question is if there will be problems to overclock my gpu beyond 864 after the MOD and if yes where i could provide myself with the unlocked and proper asus bios from or how could i mod the existing bios to clear this 864 border. Thank you! :)

I got nothing. Bumpity-bump. Anyone?

[8bit_terror]

it seems that hd3870 produced by f....ing asus is a completely other stuff i was unable to find where is r1222 resistor, i look everywhere by a scope and nothing..., somebody help?

[Random Murderer]

as stated many times by myself on this forum and others, there is no pencil mod(or hard mod for that matter) for asus cards until the specs for their proprietary chips get released. sorry. buy a reference card next time.;)

[Random Murderer]

sorry about that. i had a bad day at work.

i realize you probably did not sit and read all 38 pages of this thread.
the asus cards use proprietary parts that have yet to be figured out by anyone other than asus techs, so until asus decides to release the specs, we're shit outta luck. it upsets me, because i love asus. i can tell you which chip is the pwm but not which pin is the feedback pin(the one needed for a pencil or hard mod), since that i do not know. if you're up to it, you can just randomly shade resistors around the pwm until the desirable effect happens, but you may kill your card in the process. then again, you may figure out which pin is the feedback pin and be a hero.

[8bit_terror]

hehe it will be funny doing it as drawing on sheet of paper but won't risk it for now and i think that 860/1260 is reasonable speeds for now, thank you

[8bit_terror]

...just want to mention that my previous card was ASUS EAH3850 OC GEAR and with this card I was able to play CRYSIS with approximately 25-32 fps using 2xAA 1280:1024 and everything on HIGH details, my current card as I said before is ASUS EAH3870 TOP and with this s...t the same game is worst playable at 1024:768 everything on high without AA,,,,,,,,,,IS THERE SOMEONE WHO COULD GIVE ME SOME EXPLAINATION FOR THIS, PLEASE???????????????????????????????????????????? ????????

[monohouse]

I have been reading a little about this mod, but I have a few questions:

what kind of pencil has numbers to it ? what does 4B 2B and 4H mean ?
you didn't specify the temperatures @ stock voltage+full load / 1.44V+full load
less than 900 mhz for 1.44 v doesn't look very promising but maybe it's the temperatures so what are the temperatures ? what is the room temperature ?

you also didn't specify the maximum speed you were able to achieve before the modding

I have a sapphire hd3870, at stock voltage it is fully stable at 843 mhz without mods (ram 1250)
room temp is 35 C and gpu temp at full load is 65 C, water cooling with silver paste and copper block, does it make sense for me to do the mod ? for just 48 mhz....

[Dr. Spankenstein]

A correctly done pencil-mod can get you up to 1.6V, if you want. I get over 1GHz core with that voltage. 100% fan on stock cooler and temps hover around 70c.

Worth it...you betcha! ;)

[monohouse]

where do you buy the pencil ?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

The softer pencils (4h) you might have to get at an art supply or drafting store. Softer just makes it a bit easier to lay down a good, even amount of graphite.

There is always the pencil-mod where you "create" a trace between two pads by roughing the surface of the PCB then you pencil the new trace you made. Seems better for higher volts, but a bit figgity to get accurate voltages. Upside is that is seems less prone to losing it's grip. The resistor shading needs to be protected (so that the graphite doesn't fall/blow off) or re-applied frequently.

That's why I broke out the soldeing iron. BOOF! Done.

[monohouse]

can you show me what you meen ? is there an image of the complete mod ? if it falls off it sucks

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Here is the "alternate" pencil-mod marked in yellow.

http://img.techpowerup.org/080713/hd3870pmodsl4828.png

This is the hard mod.

http://img.techpowerup.org/080406/HardMod.jpg

:toast:

[monohouse]

cheese's chrisp @ hardmod

[Random Murderer]

cheese's chrisp @ hardmod

lol, "cheese's chrisp"

[monohouse]

potenziometer ?

[Random Murderer]

potenziometer ?

trimmer, aka trimpot, a very accurate, multi-turn potentiometer in a small package.

[monohouse]

chool, how about completely without resistance ? 0 ohms ? and maybe both mods with 0 ohms could be better ? maybe 2000 mhz on phase ? btw how long does it take for dry ice and liquid nitrogen to evaporate ? maybe manually increase more voltage from the psu as well ? like another few volts

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Zero resistance would be the same as bridging the connection=bad for card. Fun while it lasted (1 min, maybe.) and uber-xtreme, but not very practical.

Still wanting to do this? You're in the right place...

[monohouse]

you bet, just a matter of time, but im not sure if it's worth for extra 100 mhz I meen, if it was 2000 then yhe, so I was thinking maybe possible... maybe if it can 1500 or so, but if liquid nitrogen can only do 1200, what chance I have to go beyond 1000 with just watr ?

how do you have 70 C at 1.6V at 1000 mhz with just stock cooling ? what room temp
do you remember what speed it could go when it was stock voltage ? and what temp and room temp then ?
I meen if I have 65 C and silver and copper and watr and no overvoltage it doesn't make sense that stock cooling has only 5 degrees higher than that, not to mention overvolted and overclocked, ... alaska ?

when I had the stock cooling it was getting to 90-100 and then throttling and there was no overclock then

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Firstly, from your max 843 to my max 1020 is more than 100mhz (177 to be exact.)

Stock reference cooler with fan @ 100%=cool, loud and 75C (70C is for my 24/7 setting of 970core) 1.6V.
Ambients are almost always around 23C.

My max before mod was the same or less than yours.

I'm not sure why your temps are such with water...

[monohouse]

maybe I know, my room temp is 35 C, what is the ohmage for that voltage for R1222 ? 0.5 K ?

[sneekypeet]

Firstly, from your max 843 to my max 1020 is more than 100mhz (177 to be exact.)

Stock reference cooler with fan @ 100%=cool, loud and 75C (70C is for my 24/7 setting of 970core) 1.6V.
Ambients are almost always around 23C.

My max before mod was the same or less than yours.

I'm not sure why your temps are such with water...

I have to agree....65*C load on water?...something isnt right. Irealize this isnt way overclockd or overvolted, but... http://forums.techpowerup.com/showpost.php?p=559113&postcount=1

I had my card pencil modded to 1.55V at one point with the stock cooler at about 75% and was keeping your water temp.

I really dont think overvolting my card would have put an extra 25*C into my loop.

[monohouse]

hi, did you have the watr before the mod ? how mutch temperature increased when you put the mod ? I don't think it will be easy to increase my whole loop as it is parallel configuration and 3x120mm and fans at 12V, I am more concerned about the temperature at the card itself

[sneekypeet]

I had it on the loop for a bit, but it brought my CPU up 4* under load, so I ended up going back to air to finish the mod. I had 1.45V to the core and the card maxed @50*C

[monohouse]

and what is your room temp ? maybe you have a serial watr loop and not enough radiators ?

[JrRacinFan]

Thanks RM. I am going to try this soon guys so wish me luck. Speaking of which, if I up the volts via bios does it truly change it? Also, is a DMM really needed for this? I don't have one.

[monohouse]

no it doesn't change, I tried many times, DMM is the only way to measure, and the only way to be sure not sure if it has a voltage sensor in it, but as far as I know it doesn't

[dark2099]

I would say a DMM is a good idea, don't wanna push that many volts and not know it. Changing the volts through BIOS is do able on some cards I think, but you would need a DMM to be 100% sure. That IceQ cooler should be able to keep the temps down better than the stock coolers.

[JrRacinFan]

Thanks for the information mono & dark.

[sneekypeet]

no it doesn't change, I tried many times, DMM is the only way to measure, and the only way to be sure not sure if it has a voltage sensor in it, but as far as I know it doesn't

Bios voltage will change if the PCB has the archetecture to allow it...thats why w1zzard started the tread on it!

[JrRacinFan]

Hmmm so does the ICEq3 Turbo allow it then?

[sneekypeet]

Hmmm so does the ICEq3 Turbo allow it then?

you need to verify the position of a resister on the PCB....looking for the thread now.

EDIT: http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=53220

[erocker]

I have deleted posts that throw this thread further off topic. Let's get back to what this thread is supposed to be about. Thank you!

[Random Murderer]

you need to verify the position of a resister on the PCB....looking for the thread now.

EDIT: http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=53220

like sneeky said, certain cards allow and certain cords don't, even if they all use the reference pcb. the only way to know is to check that resistor and if it's in the right position, try the bios mod. even though my card is supposedly able to change voltage through bios, i couldn't get a voltage boost that way, hence this thread.

[monohouse]

that's odd, I have 1.355 V stock voltage not 1.33, and my default resistance is 1.620 K also not as specified 1.5 K

I managed to reduce to around 1.45 K but I can't do any better, it seems that if I press on the resistor the resistance decreases is that recommended ?

I acheved 815 ohms with more pressure on the resistor, what would be the resistance needed for 1.6V ?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

You could try different shading techniques. I found that if you ran your pencil over a piece of paper (while holding the pencil at the same angle) you create a "chisel-point" on the tip. Wear the pencil down until the tip is the same width of the resistor, then give one smooth, firm pass. This keeps down the "back-and-forth" motion that can actually remove some of the graphite you laid on previous passes.

Then again, some shade across the width of the resistor. It's a lot of strokes, but if you wrap your shading around to the sides of the resistor some say this method helps them reduce resistance more.

[monohouse]

so as to increase the coverage of the area, I understand, thanks, im gonna fire it up and see what 800 ohms do for the temp and voltage and more importantly, mhz :D

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Right on! Go, GO, GO! :toast:

[monohouse]

ok, here is another odd thing: only 1.45 V at 800 ohms at 843 mhz, doesn't make sense....unless voltage is frequency-dependant, is it ? the temp is still in the 60's.... I fired up a higher resolution, increased frequency to 857 mhz and voltage increased to 1.460

[Dr. Spankenstein]

You saying you've reduced the resistance to 800ohms and you still only report 1.45V on the DMM?
That is odd...unless PowerPlay is kicking in.

Have you put a load on it (like ATITool artifact finder or RTHDRBL) to see if it changes?

[monohouse]

furmark 640x480 8x AA windowed and race driver GRID 1600x1200 2x AA fullscreen, the latter is for stability testing, I was NEVER able to get past 843 mhz without freezing, and now it's doing it without sweating in the 60's, it is the right direction I think, does powerplay always shut down if there is heavy load ?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

I was just thinking that the voltages might not kick in until the 3D clocks are activiated (gaming, benching.)

I agree, sounds like you are on the right track! Could you clarifiy your voltage under load?

[monohouse]

just checked it once again, 1.458 VDC, rivatuner shows 100% gpu usage, 63 C temp and 850 mhz frequency, im gonna try to up it to 864 and use the new bios

[Dr. Spankenstein]

I think the goal would be 1.55~1.6V or aprox. 1.0k resistance. That should get you around 1GHz core.

Think the only way to get there would be the "New" or "German" mod or hard mod.

http://img.techpowerup.org/080713/hd3870pmodsl4828.png

[monohouse]

lol I was just scrolling back to the previous page, thanks, sayin can those two be combined for additional impact or are there additional considerations ? R1270 has a relatively high resistance what are the lower limits for it ?, because i think the pencil might have bigger impact on this one than on the other one

ok here's the latest, I got it to 864 mhz with new bios and it's 1.457 VDC which leads me to conclude that the voltage is not frequency dependant, I have removed the card and rechecked the resistance it now shows 740, I wanted to be sure that something didn't change, but it should increase not deacease voltage....

[kenkickr]

OK, I have tried and tried on my Sapphire 3870 single slot for a couple hours and feel I'm getting no where. My stock resistance is 1.86. the lowest I've made it was 1.79 but it seems if I blow on it or start touching it with the 4B it goes right backup. Any recommendations? Also it looks like the new mod will not work on the Sapphire single slots.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

@monohouse,

I guess you could combine both mods, but then I'm not sure where you would measure resistance. Were it me, I'd just do the "new" mod. As far as the 1270 resistor, I'm not sure if it is in line with the feedback pin of the voltage IC to make any difference.

@kenkickr,

That is the "rub" (sorry for the pun) with the pencil mods. Not very permanent unless you get you voltages where you want and then protect it with clear nail polish or tape. Even then, they still degrade over time. I'm sure with either a softer pencil OR a few more attempts with different shading techniques (as described a few posts back) you can reduce the resistance further. How much, I'm not sure. Just check voltages during boot and shut down if they are excessive.

[monohouse]

so far I got it to 4.40 from 5.12 (new) is that any good ? measuring at C670 as specified

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Did you "scratch" the PCB between those pads so the graphite will stick?

Sounds like you're getting there. Did you decide to "combo" your mods?

Awaiting new voltage readings...:D

[monohouse]

ok 4.32 K the lowest I got so far, deleted the old, trying the new, I tried to scratch as much as I can without actually removing the pcb cover

[tigger]

Could you possibly combine some pencil lead dust with some pva glue or something similar to make a sort of resistance paste that will not wear off? Its just an idea.If you make it well enough it could even have a certain resistance for a certain length of line of it,ie the line length of the resistor.

You can flame me if you like guys :p its just a wacky idea.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

There was a forum member (trog100) who used this mod. the first time he tried it, he had to shut down because of the rediculous voltage that was being put to the card (around 1.7V).

Starting to wonder if the layouts of the new cards have more aggressive OVP/OCP that the reference models...

[monohouse]

W00000000000000000000000t : 1.647 VDC @ 4.32 K new ! thanks ! and what's better temp is still in the 60's (but the higher 60's)

did you say wear off ?

im clocking it to 1000 (bios) and rebooting, let's see how it's goin...yep, rivatuner shows 999 mhz

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Whoa boy! Have fun with that one! The bonus of these is that the increased Vcore adds a little voltage to the RAM as well (watch the heat on those, RAM artifacts are pretty obvious)!

Great job on a successful mod! :toast:

Now on to posting some benchmark scores!

[monohouse]

it looks like after a while it's starting to hit the early 70's tho.

777, 843, 1000, looks like it's not the end of it, no ram artifacts yet, how long does it take for the mod to wear off ? considerin that there is no fan blowing onto the upper area of the pcb

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Well, if 1GHz was your goal, you could try to remove a tiny bit of graphite (like with the point of your DMM probe) to make your volts come to 1.60V. That would take a little heat off.

Do you have a full-coverage block? That will dump a lot of heat into your loop.

[monohouse]

what is a full coverage block ? I have the Bigwater 795 vga block, the cpu temp has increased to 61 from 57, I thought I didn't believe it, but now I do... (core 0 61, core 1 59) 2 prime's and a furmark

http://manoa.flnet.org/Pics/1000.png

so, now that we have a proof of concept, how do we get to 2000 ?

[tigger]

http://img.techpowerup.org/080714/WC-004-EK_200.jpg

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=WC-004-EK&groupid=701&catid=193&subcat=1035&name=EK%20HD%203870%20Full%20Cover%20VGA%20Water%2 0Block

:)

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Full coverage meaning the waterblock is cooling both the core and memory chips.

Awesome clocks though. Maybe you just use them to game and benchmark. That Bigwater isn't going to be able to keep up with your heat.

[monohouse]

ah you meen so I could also cover the ram ? im not sure it is necessary but it would be good, maybe in the future sometime. thanks

I tried a 1039.50 mhz but it froze now I am trying 1026.00 it seems stable

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Very respectable clocks, my man!

[monohouse]

not quite so.... looks like in furmark it's stable and no artifacts at 999 and 1026, but in race driver grid mode it has artifacts at 999, froze once at 985 so I had to reduce to 972, maybe when it's winter and I get a 15 C room temp I think I will do better

my guess is that the gpu itself is not the problem, I figure the rest of the components are the problem and since they have no fan on them, they may be overheating, im sure if I toss a couple of 8 cm fans on the front of the card it should manage 1026 mhz just fine

it also seems that temp has gone up to 74 C in race driver grid than it would be only barely 70 in furmark, so it would seem will have to settle for the extra 129 mhz for now

you mean the block won't keep up with heat or the whole system ? I think you're right it has gone up to 74 C but doesn't go above that yet, I wonder if with this new speed it can reach the stock performance of the 4850

I have set the powerplay to boot: 200/400, 2d: 250/400, 3d #1: 648/800, 3d #2: 972/1242, is that good ?

just the other day I was having some system freezes in race driver grid, after some investigations I have realized there maybe were some problems with the overclocking/voltage:

at first I didn't notice it, but it would seem that the voltage has dropped from 1.657 to 1.648 VDC, after checking it seems that my bios modification had a clock of 1.65 in it, so it maybe was related, now I have written 2.0 volts into it to make sure.

the other problem was much different, it seems that when the in-game setting of MSAA/AA is active at the resolution of 1600x1200 it causes system freezes even at speeds as low as 945 mhz and even there still causes freezes, after I disabled AA I noticed there are no freezes anymore and upped the frequency to 972 mhz again, and it worked fine, it would seem that antialias at high resolutions may cause some things to get out of hand, I am testing this now with more previse observations.

my max frequencies I managed after rearranging the pipes and adding two 8 cm fans at the front is 972/1179, only a little increase from 1161 on ram from the two 8cm fans, and core at the moment is the same, room temp at time of testing is 31.5 C and voltage apperantly has dropped from 1.648 or 1.657 to 1.598/1.605 VDC, for unknown reason

http://manoa.flnet.org/Pics/972.png

[KurosakiIchigo]

Hi everyone!
i broke my R1222 resistor and the card doesn't boot... if i use the trimmer mod , maybe i can repair my board ?

[monohouse]

I guess, if you can avoid further damage from the hardmodding (I didn't, and broke a GF4mx440 by trying to solder a capacitor that fell off).

[Random Murderer]

Hi everyone!
i broke my R1222 resistor and the card doesn't boot... if i use the trimmer mod , maybe i can repair my board ?

hmm. maybe... i think the hard mod actually completely bypasses the resistor, so give it a shot.

[KurosakiIchigo]

hmm. maybe... i think the hard mod actually completely bypasses the resistor, so give it a shot.

thanks for the answers!!
can i have a detailed screenshot of the hard mod ?
i didn't find it!

[KurosakiIchigo]

thanks for the answers!!
can i have a detailed screenshot of the hard mod ?
i didn't find it!

is this pot good for the hard mod ?
http://www.webtronic.it/pages/ITA/prodotto.asp?ProdottoID=17610&FamigliaID=0

[tigger]

That should be fine.

http://img.techpowerup.org/080801/my mod.jpg

This is my 3850 mod,its the same for 3870 i believe.

[Random Murderer]

That should be fine.

http://img.techpowerup.org/080801/my mod.jpg

This is my 3850 mod,its the same for 3870 i believe.

yes, it's the same for a 3870.

[KurosakiIchigo]

That should be fine.

http://img.techpowerup.org/080801/my mod.jpg

This is my 3850 mod,its the same for 3870 i believe.

thanks!!!
i'll try tomorrow :D

[thoughtdisorder]

thanks!!!
i'll try tomorrow :D

Excellent! Take your time, be very methodical, and if you get stuck, STOP and post a question or two. We'll be here for you man! (And if Random is sleeping I'll wake his ass up!) -He's my son....:)