What to expect from NVIDIA

[W1zzard]

[Page=Introduction]
Introduction
I got these slides in my inbox on friday, the sender did not even mention if they were made by a manufacturer or if they are user-made.
When asked, he only revealed that the presentation is not user made, but he can't reveal his source..

So please take the information presented with a grain of salt. As I see it, this presentation could come from:

ATI
NVIDIA
User side


Ask yourself who has something to gain from making it.

UPDATE: Today I received word that this presentation is indeed from ATI.

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[GoLLuM4444]

As I see it, this presentation could come from:

ATI
NVIDIA
User side


Ask yourself who has something to gain from making it.
I really don't think that's from nVidia - have you even read it?? :confused:

[W1zzard]

cmon look at how cheap this presentation is done ... in theory nvidia could spread it, and given its quality, ati would look bad

[GoLLuM4444]

I suppose so - but there are SOME good points in there and actual quotes of reviewers preferring ATi X1k series cards. I don't think nVidia would insult themselves just to make ATi look a bit cheap.

[wtf8269]

The slide about prices made me feel a lot better, well really the whole thing made me feel a lot better. I think that means we can expect to see Sapphires, Connect3Ds, Xtasys, etc at a price similar to the 7800s on newegg.

[djbbenn]

cmon look at how cheap this presentation is done ... in theory nvidia could spread it, and given its quality, ati would look bad

Yeah, I agree. When I first saw it, it made me think of why would ATI do that. It could very easily make ATI look bad.

-Dan

[Aiko]

The only thing which matters is the FINAL price and the REAL performance of cards which you can BUY in shop. I don't care about reviews of cards which comes in quantity of 1000's.

I hate all these "unknown author slides".

Both ATI and NVidia have serious problems with chip production. Both have problems with architecture (for example ATI: how to sample texture in vertex shader on X1000 family ?, NVIDIA: why is anisotropic filtering quality on GF 6 & 7 series worse than on GF FX ?).

The worst thing that can happen is that there will be only one of them. So I hope, they'll remain competitive each other and we will benefit from it.

[ChAce]

That's not nVidia's, at any rate, why would you make your own company ridiculous? Perhaps its an unhappy employee, but other than that, no way. It's probably not ATi's either, would be a bit of a sad performance really. I've seen this kind of slides in favor of nVidia too, kind of a similar level. I think its user side...

[Polaris573]

The price slide is wrong unless it's not in USD:

$365 for a 7800GT not $499
$439 for X1800XL not $549

and so on....

I think it was created by a user. He or she is probably really excited that it got posted and we're spending our time discussing it. It makes some interesting points, but since the source is unknown it can't really be trusted.

[djbbenn]

The price slide is wrong unless it's not in USD

I wish they were in Canadian. :D GTX goes for about $650 here. :(

-Dan

[Homeless]

Seems poorly put together, I also find the pricing to be outrageously bad

[Unregistered]

THe pricing on the NV cards are wrong,
you would get 6600 GT at 170, and atleast a 6800 XL at 249!!!!
LOW END IS EVEN LOWER!

[zAAm]

If you would read the slide you would know the pricing is MSRP!! NOT what you pay on newegg and such. Sheesh :rolleyes: stop whining.

[Bob The Fish]

I wish they were in Canadian. :D GTX goes for about $650 here. :(

-Dan


i 2ed that one dan

[W1zzard]

just got news .. this presentation really is from ati

[GoLLuM4444]

just got news .. this presentation really is from ati
:eek: Didn't think they'd sink so low. :cry:

[djbbenn]

:eek: Didn't think they'd sink so low. :cry:

Ya really...:slap:

-Dan

[Polaris573]

If you would read the slide you would know the pricing is MSRP!! NOT what you pay on newegg and such. Sheesh :rolleyes: stop whining.

Woops, You're correct. I didn't pay close enough attention. :nutkick:

[Nyte]

Woops, You're correct. I didn't pay close enough attention. :nutkick:

This is THE deception that nVidia uses against people. The confusion between MSRP and street price.

If you go to every forum out there (even in Rage3D), you'll find people complaining about the outrageous prices when infact they are comparing ATi's MSRP to nVidia's street price. Deception at its best.

[ChAce]

just got news .. this presentation really is from ati
Wow... That low, its nVidia's own tactics :ohwell:

[ozzz]

i supose that it's good to know all this facts, and whe shouldn't accuse ATi or who had made this presentation (except of course that they are incorrect, which after what i knew before is pretty much true).

[Unregistered]

bah, welcome to the REAL world. standard presentment to customers from sellers - why would then choose ATI if they already bought in to nV's "lies" - the sales pitch ofcource.

[Unregistered]

read the one that talks about the pixel shader stuff from xbitlabs..........driver what???? 66.81.....how many drivers have been released since then........HELLO.....this is utter bull shit!!!!!!

If you believe it your a fricken morron.........

[Bob The Fish]

Wow... That low, its nVidia's own tactics :ohwell:


what a surpise :rolleyes:

[Cainam]

This is THE deception that nVidia uses against people. The confusion between MSRP and street price.

If you go to every forum out there (even in Rage3D), you'll find people complaining about the outrageous prices when infact they are comparing ATi's MSRP to nVidia's street price. Deception at its best.
it's not deception at all. it's reality, at least in the short term until ati ships in quantity. too many people were stung by the fact ati's product deliver were so bad, that for quite some time ati's street prices were higher than MSRP.

there are 2 facts right now. 1) you can't purchase an x800xt at any price, and 2) you can purchase 7800 GT's (and even GTX's) for less money than you cna an x1800XL.

the bottom line is that it's ATI who is trying to create confusion about how much these products will cost.

[bruins004]

I must say that ATI and Nvidia both make good video cards, but the ATI sucks at pricing and delivery. If you want to be competitive and make a good impression than you gotta do these things correctly. After seeing this presentation from ATI, its sad that they would have to resort to these kind of ways. It shows you that they are in trouble and would do anything. So sad. ATI kinda does this to themselves :nutkick:

[mikeguava]

Rofl - doubt it really came from ATI - unless an ATI employee made a private joke - lol - gives NVidia some taste of its own medicine - too funny

[Unregistered Roland]

I have never read such a bullshit! LOL!



Noobs give much for MB's! More MB's isn't alway's better.... Mostly, more MB's, lower quality of memory! Because it needs not to high prices!
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/ATI/WhatToExpect/images/WhatToExpect-14.jpg

The site has more ATI stuff than NVIDIA...

And NVIDIA where first with cards with HDR.... And ATI has now with the X1000 series PS3.0. NVIDIA has it 1 jear ago PS3.0....

And NVIDIA Cards scores good... I'm not complaining about this piece of hardware... And not every company can be always the best company...

And every driver has his bugs, as ati and nvidia...
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/ATI/WhatToExpect/images/WhatToExpect-16_small.jpg

But this site doesn't say here what's ati's bugs....
This is more an unfair and badest tests i have ever seen...


Watch here for a real test.:
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2552
P.S. Watch the hole test and you see that every card has his weakness and the performance is differend per game...

See this:
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/ati%20radeon%20x1000%20launch_10050581026/9345.png

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/ati%20radeon%20x1000%20launch_10050581026/9348.png

It's very differend for games... Just look for prices because the GeForce 7 is a good card, and the ATI x1000 series to. Look for the cheapest and you will be happy it hink :D.

[Unregistered Roland]

The prices aren't correct to! EVEN IN HOLLAND IS IT CHEAPER (NVIDIA)!
And why do ou test old NVIDIA drivers???

[KUTJEBEF]

lot's of you guys dont know much about hardware, you're like kiddies in a sandbox.

Buying hardware is always about the money, you buy as much as you can for the money you have. Nvidia are mostly of the time better in Overclocking. Ati mostly not.

Most of you guys think Ati owns, yes, the do with the new cards, but not in every game. You have to buy a card who scores good in the games you play. For me that's Nvidia.

I can't say ati is always good, my 9800 sucks. Oke, good overclocking. BUT only with the oldest catalyst drivers i can run the card, if i use the newer one's, then i have alot of trouble, lots of artifacts :S.

It's dificult to say who's better, you guys should do more research and think more, then you can make a nice conclusion.

SO THINK before posting.

[15th Warlock]

there are 2 facts right now. 1) you can't purchase an x800xt at any price...

I think you are referring to the X1800XT, not the X800XT, which can be found in great quantities everywhere...

[Unregistered DIldo]

I agree with Kutjebef!
It's differend at all times... It depends on prices and games (what you play a lot).
ATI = een hoetje :)
NVIDIA = een sletje :)
Allemaal lekker! :)
Dildo

[KUTJEBEF]

yea, the screen quality of nvidia is really good, and good for playing porn movies.

[15th Warlock]

I can't say ati is always good, my 9800 sucks. Oke, good overclocking. BUT only with the oldest catalyst drivers i can run the card, if i use the newer one's, then i have alot of trouble, lots of artifacts :S.


That's weird, in every review you can find on the web, the 9800 blew out of the water any videocard nVidia threw at it in every single benchmark at the time it came out and even some time after that (FX5900, FX5950, and so on...)
I never had artifacts with my old 9800XT using newer versions of the Catalyst drivers up to the 5.7 ver, you should check your system, maybe there's something wrong with it...

[Unregistered Roland]

What you didn't see is that many people destroy the're own 9800... They are weak in tuning.... Even the GF5900 could get even higher clockings...
My friend had an 9800 pro and was an PRO tuner.... The card wasn't good to tune...

[zAAm]

Tuning is something you generally do to cars, not computers. ;) If you'd have said 'tweaking' or 'overclocking' it'd be better. hehe. But don't worry too much about it. And the 9800 couldn't necessarily clock higher than a FX5900, but they could still provide better performance! This thread isn't keeping to topic anyway... :)

[Unregistered]

the price points are correct if you check their sources of MSRP so the ad is not lying about that. Nvidians get so offended when no one is praising the 7800.

[Solaris17]

Nvidians..................lol that made my day thnx :)

[Unregistered Roland]

ATI 9800 is a weak card, they are fast broken....
I had an ATI... it couldn't handle much...
And setting voltage higher can't handle my ATI...
IT sucks...
I have an 6800LE unlocked now.... for 1 jear and i score with 3D mark 2003 9000 marks!
1 Year ago for just 199 Euro! :D
That's i like! And it can reach mass clockings and scores, I can tweak m up to 11000 marks without any problems.... :D

[Unregistered]

"the price points are correct if you check their sources of MSRP so the ad is not lying about that. Nvidians get so offended when no one is praising the 7800."

Than is NVIDIA in the Netherlands cheaper! LOL! :D
That sucks for you! :)

NVIDIA Makes my day good! :D
Good performance....


Even with DOOM III has the new cards (x1000 series) less FPS than a GF7800GT!!!
And UT2004.... THAN IS THE X1800XT LESS POWERFULL THAN A 6800GT!
And there will come more games based on DOOM III engine, such as Quake IV and ENEMY TERRITORY QUAKEWARS.... ATI must design a better OpenGL engine.... That's why NVIDIA scores better than ATI by DOOM III.

[Unregistered]

cmon look at how cheap this presentation is done ... in theory nvidia could spread it, and given its quality, ati would look bad

Doesen't anyone rember that cheap slideshow nVidia realeased comparing SLI to Crossfire about a month or two ago? I can't seem to find it, but it was much worse than this

[grazzhoppa]

The Inquirer followed up with the claims in these slides. here (http://theinquirer.net/?article=27084)

They say the 6800 and 7800 fail the SM 3.0 WHQL tests even with newer drivers.

[MikBach]

The Inquirer followed up with the claims in these slides. here (http://theinquirer.net/?article=27084)

They say the 6800 and 7800 fail the SM 3.0 WHQL tests even with newer drivers.
The tests, where the G70 fails, are not really importent for SM3.
BTW NV only fails, because they are rendering in another way, than the RefRast do.
The G70 has full SM3-compatibility.

[MikBach]

(for example ATI: how to sample texture in vertex shader on X1000 family ?,
Indeed the X1000 can not sample FP16-textures in the Vertexshader. FX16 is not a problem.
But you can fix it with a shader:
http://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=3561761&postcount=24

Sorry, but it´s german.