new battle new intel cpu's don't support sli

[hayder.master]

come and see now new intel cpu Nehalem don't support sli

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Nvida-039-s-SLI-Technology-Gets-No-Love-From-Intel-039-s-Nehalems-83629.shtml

[ShadowFold]

Looks like Nvidia is screwed.. If this is true then like the article said, they would lose alot of money and customers.

[HTC]

come and see now new intel cpu Nehalem don't support sli

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Nvida-039-s-SLI-Technology-Gets-No-Love-From-Intel-039-s-Nehalems-83629.shtml

DAMN: this can be a decisive blow to nVidia's high-end market!

[File_1993]

Well, back in the time of the NF4 and NF5 chipsets, SLI was available only with AMD cpu's right? Nvidia will be fine with it and so will AMD-ATI. From the looks of this, Nvidia might push on fast single chip GFX's while ATI also might push on the Crossfire technology...

[smig]

I think this will come back to Intel as a bumerang.
AMD-ATI will dominate the gaming market.

The best Intel can do is going together with nVidia agains AMD-ATI.
Maybe nVidia should go with Motorola for the next gaming PC ? this will leave Intel alone in the hot desert.

[jonmcc33]

Intel has never supported SLI in it's chipsets. This is nothing new.

SLI is a complete waste anyway.

[lemonadesoda]

Well, personally, I think this is GOOD NEWS. Why?

nVidia will be forced to develop a better ONE SOCKET GPU solution. Just like ATi does the x2 series... I'm sure nVidia will be successful in increasing the performance of a single die, and then twinning 2 on one card.

If the net net is faster single cards, and lower power consumption... then its a win for all us consumers. Might take nvida 6 months to change strategy... "high end = single card".

[DanishDevil]

Might take nvida 6 months to change strategy... "high end = single card".

More like 6 pcb's :roll:

/sarcasm

Definitely interesting stuff. If nVidia wants to keep the high-end market, we will definitely be seeing some more high-end single GPU cards from them. It will be like the days of the 8800Ultra, but with ATi's X2's in the mix as well.

I was kind of hoping that down the road developers would begin supporting multi-threading of graphics like they do programs for CPUs. Looks like this puts at least one pretty large nail in that coffin, though.

[FreedomEclipse]

oh well looks like im either gonna be forced to stay AMD or throw away my more or less new 8800GTS (G92) just for the sake of crossfire....

I know i can still use the 8800GTS as a single card but i was so looking forward to sli :(

[ShadowFold]

Intel has never supported SLI in it's chipsets. This is nothing new.

SLI is a complete waste anyway.

I think the article is saying the CPU wont support SLi so it doesnt matter if the chipset doesnt or not.

[DanishDevil]

oh well looks like im either gonna be forced to stay AMD or throw away my more or less new 8800GTS (G92) just for the sake of crossfire....

I know i can still use the 8800GTS as a single card but i was so looking forward to sli :(

Would you really be buying that many cores? I honestly think you'd be much happier on a speedy dual or quad core.

I just went Intel from a 5000+BE to an E6300 and I loved it, and just picked up an E8500 and I'm screaming. Quad cores...psh...who needs 'em?

[DanishDevil]

SLI is a complete waste anyway.

If you are gaming on a monitor with a resolution at or larger than 1680x1050 with current games on high details, multi-GPU is almost a must for 60+FPS. Don't make silly claims just because they don't apply to you :cool:

[BarbaricSoul]

I think the article is saying the CPU wont support SLi so it doesnt matter if the chipset doesnt or not.

can the CPU really limit the chipset? Intel doesn't support SLI as is, that's one of the reasons why we use nvidia chipset motherboards(atleast that's my understanding), to be able to use SLI on a intel cpu system.

[theonetruewill]

I'm sorry but I think you guys are taking this a little too seriously. The percentage of the market that actually uses SLI is frankly miniscule. It's not going to make too much difference IF and stress IF, the CPU hinders SLI usage. Ask yourself this - how many people do you actually know that use SLI?
There are only 2,363 steam users are using Nvidia SLI. We know that not all of them are using SLI at the same time but Nvidia claims that it sold three million SLI compatible boards and eight million SLI compatible graphic cards.
Source (http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquirer/news/2006/03/16/steam-survey-report-shows--sli-98-per-cent-crossfire-138-per-cent)
What I love is Nvidia's claim- well yeah heck I even bought an SLI compatible board and I have owned an SLI compatible card too- but did I use SLI, hell no.

[DeathTyrant]

From the looks of this, Nvidia might push on fast single chip GFX's while ATI also might push on the Crossfire technology... I bloody well hope so. I want a real hardcore beast of a card. Something to make me chuck my 8800GTX.

[pentastar111]

I;m sorry but I think you guys are taking this a little too seriously. The percentage of the market that actually uses SLI is frankly miniscule. It's not going to make too much difference IF and stress IF, the CPU hinders SLI usage. Ask yourself this - how many people do you actually know that use SLI?

What I love is Nvidia's claim- well yeah heck I even bought an SLI compatible board and I have owned an SLI compatible card too- but did I use SLI, hell no.
I do.

[candle_86]

won't phase Nvidia, as everything has shown in games a fast CPU out weighs a fast CPU. Tell me will your e8500 oced to 3ghz running an 8800GS take on an x2 5000BE oced to 3ghz with an 8800GTX?

Nope, the CPU is faster, but the GFX isnt. It just means for good gaming power AMD is the way to go once more, simple as that

[DeathTyrant]

If that is to be the case, then I could get an AMD chip next, and the x64 badge on my Lian Li would be fitting once more. :D

[beyond_amusia]

Maybe Intel has done this in retaliation for nVidia teaming up with Via on that $45 computer... But I don't understatand them teaming you with AMD and supporting CrossFire... Does that strike anyone as really odd? Concidering that Intel is ramping up it's own intergrated GPU/CPU solution and possibly making there own graphics cards soon... These are odd times we are living in, lmao.

[BarbaricSoul]

won't phase Nvidia, as everything has shown in games a fast CPU out weighs a fast CPU. Tell me will your e8500 oced to 3ghz running an 8800GS take on an x2 5000BE oced to 3ghz with an 8800GTX?

Nope, the CPU is faster, but the GFX isnt. It just means for good gaming power AMD is the way to go once more, simple as that

acouple things-

1st off, the e8500 is stock at 3.16 gig

2nd, in the middle of my last upgrade to my current system, I had a x2 5200 running with this GX2 I have now, my benchmark was around 10,000 with the 5200 and the gx2. When I got my e8400(which is stock at 3 gig) and 750ftw motherboard running, my benchmarks went to 15000 and I did see a very noticable performance gain.

3rd, AMD don't have shit on Intel once the OC'ing starts

4th, I beleive that x2 5000, even OC to 3 gig's, is gonna bottleneck the GTX card(just like my 5200 OC to 2874mhz did to my gx2), so yes, I believe the 8500 with the GS card will out do the 5000 with the GTX

[spearman914]

NO SLI!! How about crossfire?

[theonetruewill]

I do.

Understood - but you are in the vast minority (I love oxymorons)

[Morgoth]

thx for posting now i can put in on nehalemnews forum :)
crossfire gets fully suportened on nehalem even fact is that you can use quad fire
16x 8x
16x 16x
16x 16x 16x 16x
Pci-e gen2

i love this news

[newtekie1]

I don't know what Intel is thinking. The only thing keeping their competitor afloat is their graphics card devision, why would they purposely shoot nVidia in the foot to give their bigger competitor a monopoly?

[ShadowFold]

I don't know what Intel is thinking. The only thing keeping their competitor afloat is their graphics card devision, why would they purposely shoot nVidia in the foot to give their bigger competitor a monopoly?

I think its cause nvidia started bragging about how intel cant make good gpu's.

[Wile E]

This article is blowing stuff out of proportion. The current Intel cpus and chipsets don't support SLI either. nVidia has to design their own chipsets for Intel systems to run SLI. That's all that's gonna happen here too. This article is a whole bunch of nothing.

[newtekie1]

This article is blowing stuff out of proportion. The current Intel cpus and chipsets don't support SLI either. nVidia has to design their own chipsets for Intel systems to run SLI. That's all that's gonna happen here too. This article is a whole bunch of nothing.

I don't know about that. Nehalem is rumored to have a lot more of the Chipset features onboard the CPU this time, so if the features of the chipset that are on the CPU don't support SLI it might be a problem for nVidia. I'm sure work around will be developed, but it might be slow going for nVidia and SLI in the beginning.

Though dual card solutions aren't exactly the major sellers, or for that matter worth it unless you are breaking records, so it shouldn't be a gigantic company crushing hit.

[echo75]

silly rumour if you ask me!!!

Intel will be shooting itself in the foot if they make their chips incompatible with SLI setups.
secondly, Intel knows many of their customers are gaming/graphic enthusiasts.Personally i would rather have a SLI set up with an older quad/conroe if it games better than a Nahelem setup thats limited to run with one card.

We just have to wait and see, coz in gameing/graphics the GPU is as important if not more important than the CPU.

[Morgoth]

why use sli when you have crossfire and hd4800 series around the corner?
since when has intel suported sli?
intel doest even have an sli license from nvidia to put sli in there chipsets
so why not forbide sli on nehalem?

[Solaris17]

If you are gaming on a monitor with a resolution at or larger than 180x1050 with current games on high details, multi-GPU is almost a must for 60+FPS. Don't make silly claims just because they don't apply to you :cool:

i couldnt agree more just because someones jealous because they cant go out and shell some big money for another card doesnt mean the tech or the ppl that have it suck

this doesnt really bother me though i think ill go with a q6600 as my next upgrade and my board supports it and im running sli so i can see that future proofing me for quite a long time.

[newtekie1]

why use sli when you have crossfire and hd4800 series around the corner?
since when has intel suported sli?
intel doest even have an sli license from nvidia to put sli in there chipsets
so why not forbide sli on nehalem?

SLI and the 9900 series is just around the same corner, don't forget.

There have been a few attempts at getting SLI support on Intel Chipsets, but nVidia required a seperate nVidia chip on the motherboard to get it to work, which Intel didn't like.

However, with the new Nehalem processors, a large part of the chipset has been moved onto the processor, so nVidia has to work with Intel to get SLI up and running on it, license or not.

[newtekie1]

If you are gaming on a monitor with a resolution at or larger than 180x1050 with current games on high details, multi-GPU is almost a must for 60+FPS. Don't make silly claims just because they don't apply to you :cool:

He does it all the time. He assumes that if he doesn't encounter the situation, no one will.

[Morgoth]

but still nehalem uses a northbridge called Tylersburg Chipset that connect to pci-e and southbridge

[Solaris17]

acouple things-

1st off, the e8500 is stock at 3.16 gig

2nd, in the middle of my last upgrade to my current system, I had a x2 5200 running with this GX2 I have now, my benchmark was around 10,000 with the 5200 and the gx2. When I got my e8400(which is stock at 3 gig) and 750ftw motherboard running, my benchmarks went to 15000 and I did see a very noticable performance gain.

3rd, AMD don't have shit on Intel once the OC'ing starts

4th, I beleive that x2 5000, even OC to 3 gig's, is gonna bottleneck the GTX card(just like my 5200 OC to 2874mhz did to my gx2), so yes, I believe the 8500 with the GS card will out do the 5000 with the GTX


i had a 6400+ BE @ 3.4Ghz and it bottlenecked my cards something feirce

[Darknova]

This article is blowing stuff out of proportion. The current Intel cpus and chipsets don't support SLI either. nVidia has to design their own chipsets for Intel systems to run SLI. That's all that's gonna happen here too. This article is a whole bunch of nothing.

Erm...no. Nehalem has the northbridge on board the chip itself. So no choice in your northbridge maker. Intel or nothing.

[Morgoth]

NO! nehalem does have a northbridge!


http://xtreview.com/images/Tylersburg%20system%201.png
http://xtreview.com/images/Tylersburg%20system%2012.png

* Tylersburg-24S – 24 PCIe lanes, 1x QuickPath Link
* Tylersburg-24D – 24 PCIe lanes, 2x QuickPath Links
* Tylersburg-36S – 36 PCIe lanes, 1x QuickPath Link
* Tylersburg-36D – 36 PCIe lanes, 2x QuickPath Links

[Darknova]

NO! nehalem does have a northbridge!

Erm...no. The memory controller is on-die just like AMD uses, and as Crossfire X support will be built into the chip itself the only Intel boards that will need a northbridge will be nvidia based ones.

Don't forget, the southbridge handles all the HDDs, USBs, etc. etc.

So unless I'm missing something, there will be no northbridge.

[Morgoth]

so for what is Tylersburg?

[Darknova]

so for what is Tylersburg?

Never mind...

[Morgoth]

http://www.nehalemnews.com/2008/04/article-tylersburg-chipset.html
no its not SLI
-- edite
so i won

[Darknova]

http://www.nehalemnews.com/2008/04/article-tylersburg-chipset.html
no its not SLI

Interesting...first article I've seen that explains Tylesburg.

And it's still not a northbridge. Just an interconnect chip.

Intel’s Lynnfield processor is a Nehalem micro-architecture-based monolith quad-core microprocessor in LGA1160 form-factor with dual-channel DDR3 memory controller as well as PCI Express 2.0 x16 interface to connect add-on graphics cards.

Intel’s Havendale processor is multi-chip module (MCM) in LGA1160 form-factor containing Nehalem micro-architecture-based dual-core CPU as well as graphics and memory controller hub (GMCH) that features dual-channel DDR3 memory controller, PCI Express 2.0 x16 interface to connect add-on graphics cards as well as integrated graphics core. It is projected that both chips on the MCM are made using 45nm process technology.

Since both Lynnfield and Havendale have memory controller as well as PCI Express interconnection inside, there will be no need for GMCH (or North Bridge) on the mainboard. Instead, the new processors will connect directly to code-named Ibexpeak platform controller hub (PCH) that will carry hard drive controller, wired and wireless network controllers, monitor physical interfaces, PCI controller and other input/output as well as platform-related capabilities.

Source:Read this :) (http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20071128224521_Intel_s_Mainstream_Nehalem_Chips_Ex pected_to_Eliminate_North_Bridge_Necessity.html)

[Morgoth]

then we just call it a chipset

[Darknova]

yes it is a northbridge

No, it's an interconnect chip. This connects to the PCH (basically the Southbridge), just like the CPU does.

[Morgoth]

i edited my post lol

[Darknova]

i edited my post lol

Hehe, wordplay's fun :D

But, basically you'll have the CPU with on-board memory controller (triple-channel) and Crossfire X support connected to the PCH (or southbridge/northbridge/chipset), and the Tylesburg will provide the PCI-E 2.0 lanes, which connects to the PCH.

So instead of a southbridge and northbridge, you'll have one chipset, but it still removes SLi support as that will be on-chip if I'm reading this article correctly :)

[newtekie1]

Wait, isn't SLI independant of chipset anyway? I thought the only thing keeping SLI from working on Intel chipsets was nVidia locking down their drivers. So I think this article is just a big puff of smoke up our butts. If nVidia wants SLI to run on Intel chipsets, they will do it.

AND, the few Intel Chipset boards that support SLI natively without hacked drivers, do it by having an nVidia chip on the board also, so nVidia can just do that if they really want to. Use a chip on their own motherboards that enables SLI.

I think people have things backwards, it isn't Intel's decision if SLI will run with their new processors/chipsets, it is nVidia's.

[Darknova]

Wait, isn't SLI independant of chipset anyway? I thought the only thing keeping SLI from working on Intel chipsets was nVidia locking down their drivers. So I think this article is just a big puff of smoke up our butts. If nVidia wants SLI to run on Intel chipsets, they will do it.

AND, the few Intel Chipset boards that support SLI natively without hacked drivers, do it by having an nVidia chip on the board also, so nVidia can just do that if they really want to. Use a chip on their own motherboards that enables SLI.

I think people have things backwards, it isn't Intel's decision if SLI will run with their new processors/chipsets, it is nVidia's.

Normally yes, but we're broaching new territory here. I don't think anyone here knows exactly how much control is going to be on the chip, I'm just speculating, but I don't think they'd post an article such as this without some form of evidence that it could be true.

It is entirely possible that they have some how made it so the CPU controls whether SLi or CFX is possible, but we'll have to wait and see if anything more comes from this article.

[candle_86]

yea but you can bypass the local control of the CPU anyway, if they interercpt the data and process through another north bridge that Nvidia built and then sent the data back there isnt alot the chip can do

[Darknova]

yea but you can bypass the local control of the CPU anyway, if they interercpt the data and process through another north bridge that Nvidia built and then sent the data back there isnt alot the chip can do

But don't nvidia need some form of licence from Intel to make boards for them though?

[D4S4]

PCI Express 2.0 16x?!? :wtf:
2.0 specification is 32x, that could be split in 2x16 to enable SLI and CrossFire.

[Morgoth]

2.0 specification is 32x, that could be split in 2x16 to enable SLI and CrossFire.
you still need a chip that supports sli or crossfire
since crossfire is build in nehalem you dont need an extra chip

[erocker]

you still need a chip that supports sli or crossfire
since crossfire is build in nehalem you dont need an extra chip

Huh? Are you talking about processors?

[Azazel]

I don't know what Intel is thinking. The only thing keeping their competitor afloat is their graphics card devision, why would they purposely shoot nVidia in the foot to give their bigger competitor a monopoly?

what he said ^^

[D4S4]

You don't need a chip to do SLI or CrossFire. How come then Multichrome & CrossFire work on Intel chipsets, and SLI doesn't? Stupid nVidia locked the drivers. :shadedshu There was a driver hack to make SLI work on some Asrock board that used ALi/ULi chipset, while CrossFire worked by default. Then nVidia bought ALi/ULi. :wtf:

[Jizzler]

nVidia will simply devise some other method of detecting when SLI can and can not be enabled.

When Opterons were no longer top dog for workstations, nVidia simply enabled the support for SLI Quadros on Xeon boards (as they don't have their own 2P Intel chipset).

[xubidoo]

couldnt care less about sli or crossfire tbh ,big waste of money imho for the small performance increase ,give me a single fast card anytime over a sli/xfire setup that may or may not outperform the single card ,depending on the game.

3D Mark scores dont mean jack in the real world,sli/xfire is all about E-Peni waving imo :)

IF you actually got DOUBLE FPS from sli/xfire then maybe itd be worth it ,but up to a 50% gain (if your lucky) is not worth blowing a fortune on a 2nd card.

[newtekie1]

couldnt care less about sli or crossfire tbh ,big waste of money imho for the small performance increase ,give me a single fast card anytime over a sli/xfire setup that may or may not outperform the single card ,depending on the game.

3D Mark scores dont mean jack in the real world,sli/xfire is all about E-Peni waving imo :)

IF you actually got DOUBLE FPS from sli/xfire then maybe itd be worth it ,but up to a 50% gain (if your lucky) is not worth blowing a fortune on a 2nd card.

That used to be true, but now the single fast card can't handle what is out there. A multi-card setup is required for a decent gaming experience in certain situations. It is also nice to have an upgrade path, which is what I have used SLI for in past.

Your never going to get double the framerate, but 80% is common and worth it sometimes.

[xubidoo]

but now the single fast card can't handle what is out there. A multi-card setup is required .

Name a game OTHER than Crysis that a decent single card can't handle in a normal res?

my card is pretty low end now but i can run anything in highest detail and usually some AA with exception of crysis of course.
Sli/Xfire wouldnt improve anythign for me at all given i run games ina normal res (1680*1050)
and id suggest that the majority of ppl would be the same,most ppl dont run there PC's connected to a HDTV running in some daft res.

imo a single card can handle anything out there with the exception of Crysis,even sli/xfire cant run Crysis completly maxed with plenty of AA in a decent res and still get high FPS ,so it kinda makes owning 2 cards a bit pointless.

[Morgoth]

You don't need a chip to do SLI or CrossFire. How come then Multichrome & CrossFire work on Intel chipsets, and SLI doesn't? Stupid nVidia locked the drivers. :shadedshu There was a driver hack to make SLI work on some Asrock board that used ALi/ULi chipset, while CrossFire worked by default. Then nVidia bought ALi/ULi. :wtf:

umm cus intel got crossfire license from ati and the have crossfire on there chipsets..

[DanishDevil]

Name a game OTHER than Crysis that a decent single card can't handle in a normal res?

my card is pretty low end now but i can run anything in highest detail and usually some AA with exception of crysis of course.
Sli/Xfire wouldnt improve anythign for me at all given i run games ina normal res (1680*1050)
and id suggest that the majority of ppl would be the same,most ppl dont run there PC's connected to a HDTV running in some daft res.

imo a single card can handle anything out there with the exception of Crysis,even sli/xfire cant run Crysis completly maxed with plenty of AA in a decent res and still get high FPS ,so it kinda makes owning 2 cards a bit pointless.

Call of Duty 4 is impossible on a single card maxed out without AA or AF @ 1680x1050. I used to be extremely competitive in FPS games, and I can't have frames drop below about 50FPS when I'm playing. I'm struggling on a single card.

Don't use Crysis as an example. It wasn't coded thoroughly enough to allow enough computers to run it smoothly.

[Solaris17]

Call of Duty 4 is impossible on a single card maxed out without AA or AF @ 1680x1050. I used to be extremely competitive in FPS games, and I can't have frames drop below about 50FPS when I'm playing. I'm struggling on a single card.

Don't use Crysis as an example. It wasn't coded thoroughly enough to allow enough computers to run it smoothly.

pWn3d


i have sli and let me tell you it helps a bunch IN and not JUSt crysis my ut3 frames were 50-70 now their 165-190 nwn2 is now playable go ahead try and take your single card install Never winter nights 2 (2 year old game maybe more) and crank it up at your rez and you tell me if you get anything over 25fps OC'd i game at 1440x900 cause my lcd wont go above its native rez and forcing makes thing slook weird...i couldnt play it than but i can now ~60 the onyl games that dont benefit from sli are games like the original nwn old ut's and some other older games were the graphics card simply let you use shader model 2.0 for water effects other than that their 70% cpu based take any modern game other than crysis install the latest beta drivers and install dual GPU's and if you tell me you dont see a diff than ill tell you you need glasses

and i know sli or xfire gives some performance improvement but what im pointing out is that lately on modern games and the new drivers having more than 1 gpu is pushing framerates to what they were said to be on paper when these technologies were released

[farlex85]

Unless I am missing something, this is not at all different from what is currently the situation. Intel chipsets support crossfire, not sli. No difference. Unless the processors themselves will be incapable of running sli, but I don't see how or why they would possibly do that.

[Solaris17]

Unless I am missing something, this is not at all different from what is currently the situation. Intel chipsets support crossfire, not sli. No difference. Unless the processors themselves will be incapable of running sli, but I don't see how or why they would possibly do that.

i agree i think its all a little false i mean if intel pays nvidia to do it or nvidia and intel come up with a compromise nvidia would just change their drivers to make it work it would be a dumb move by intel if they locked the proc physically because if this does happen tens of thousands of ppl will be without sli regardless of drivers because their proc wont do it.

[newtekie1]

Name a game OTHER than Crysis that a decent single card can't handle in a normal res?

my card is pretty low end now but i can run anything in highest detail and usually some AA with exception of crysis of course.
Sli/Xfire wouldnt improve anythign for me at all given i run games ina normal res (1680*1050)
and id suggest that the majority of ppl would be the same,most ppl dont run there PC's connected to a HDTV running in some daft res.

imo a single card can handle anything out there with the exception of Crysis,even sli/xfire cant run Crysis completly maxed with plenty of AA in a decent res and still get high FPS ,so it kinda makes owning 2 cards a bit pointless.

Who said anything about normal resolutions? You are right, SLI and Crossfire wouldn't improve anything for YOU. However, you are not everyone. I didn't say SLI/Crossfire was for everyone, I said it is for some though. There are situations where it is required. Those people out there that do use those super high resolutions need a multi-GPU configuration to get playable framerates.

Why don't you try reading the whole post instead of just one section, skipping over a period making completely different sentences in your mind.

There is a big difference between: "...now the single fast card can't handle what is out there. A multi-card setup is required..." and how you quoted it and seemed to have read it: "Now the single fast card can't handle what is out there a multi-card setup is required."

[DanishDevil]

Even at normal resolutions, if you're maxing out current games, multiple GPUs help. A lot.

No, they may not be perfectly efficient, but is a 500hp engine efficient? Hardly. If you can survive on a Prius, more power to you. Some of us need more power for what we're doing.

[Ripper3]

Well, back in the time of the NF4 and NF5 chipsets, SLI was available only with AMD cpu's right? Nvidia will be fine with it and so will AMD-ATI. From the looks of this, Nvidia might push on fast single chip GFX's while ATI also might push on the Crossfire technology...

Never heard of the Nforce 4 SLi intel edition chipset?

Intel hasn't supported Nvidia's SLi on their chipsets because Nvidia was being a bitch about things, wanting to only have SLi support on their chipsets, this is Intel paying them back for the annoyance, by having them make their own chipset. Intel could liekly add SLi support, but now Nvidia must make their own chipset, again, a lot of R&D money lost, again, but they deserve a bit of a smack in the face.

Frankly, I think that the move to PCIe has just basically given GPU makers a chance to be lazy again. With AGP, you could only have one AGP slot, therefore, only one AGP graphics card per system, as it was designed for use of single graphics cards. Alienware was clsoe to releasing a system that used two AGP graphics cards, with both working, and accelerating 3D, but PCIe squashed it, there was no more need for it.
With the fact you can just have two graphics cards working together, GPU makers can just sell you a setup that's twice the cost, but having performance of 1 + 1 = 1.75. It makes upgrades easier for the people with less money for upgrades since they can add more on later, but it makes it a whole lot more expensive for high-end users, and early-adopters that want the best.
This laziness doubles profits, but without the exponential performance increase we've come to accept as standard from generation to generation (i.e. FX5900 to 6600GT, 6800GT to 7600GT). It's a piss-poor practice, perpetuated by putrid pricing and perceived performance increases (might not have made sense, but the alliteration bug bit me just a little), rather than real-world increases. Who cares how high your 3DMark score is, if you still can't play Crysis?

BAAAHH!! BRING BACK THE SINGLE GPU GENERATION! DOWN WITH MULTI-GPU!


Pardon the mood-swings

[ZenZimZaliben]

Never heard of the Nforce 4 SLi intel edition chipset?

It's a piss-poor practice, perpetuated by putrid pricing and perceived performance

That's a lot of P's.

[HTC]

It's a piss-poor practice, perpetuated by putrid pricing and perceived performance

That's a lot of P's.

It's the new 8 core Intel CPUs ...

[panchoman]

amd ftw (both graphics & cpu)

btw.. take that morgoth! :slap:

[blkhogan]

Even at normal resolutions, if you're maxing out current games, multiple GPUs help. A lot.

No, they may not be perfectly efficient, but is a 500hp engine efficient? Hardly. If you can survive on a Prius, more power to you. Some of us need more power for what we're doing.

Hahahaha.... I love it! Thats sig material there.

[imperialreign]

Who said anything about normal resolutions? You are right, SLI and Crossfire wouldn't improve anything for YOU. However, you are not everyone. I didn't say SLI/Crossfire was for everyone, I said it is for some though. There are situations where it is required. Those people out there that do use those super high resolutions need a multi-GPU configuration to get playable framerates.



agreed. For those of us with higher res monitors, and want to run closer to our native res, multi GPUs are about the only way to go anymore. Plus, the higher the res, the less of a need for the performance chugging AA/AF and other eye candy; but they'll make the experience even more enjoyable.

And if you go and play some older titles, like FEAR, it'll make you feel all fuzzy inside having everything maxed out while running 1440x900 or higher res, and still pluggin average frames of 80FPS+

[Morgoth]

amd ftw (both graphics & cpu)

btw.. take that morgoth! :slap:

comes back with
Lerabee
take that

[panchoman]

what the hell is that? :laugh:

[ShadowFold]

comes back with
Lerabee
take that

Larabee is gonna suck. You can quote me on that.

what the hell is that? :laugh:

Larabee? Intel's new graphics cards.

[eidairaman1]

I don't know about that. Nehalem is rumored to have a lot more of the Chipset features onboard the CPU this time, so if the features of the chipset that are on the CPU don't support SLI it might be a problem for nVidia. I'm sure work around will be developed, but it might be slow going for nVidia and SLI in the beginning.

Though dual card solutions aren't exactly the major sellers, or for that matter worth it unless you are breaking records, so it shouldn't be a gigantic company crushing hit.

just memory controller primarily, look at AMD 64 lineup.

[panchoman]

Larabee is gonna suck. You can quote me on that.



Larabee? Intel's new graphics cards.


the integrated gpu on the new cpus?

[Morgoth]

yes i got some more news for sli on nehalem
http://www.nehalemnews.com/

[Morgoth]

Larabee is gonna suck. You can quote me on that.
Larabee? Intel's new graphics cards.

how can you say it sucks?
its tottaly a new concept never used before
even intel doest know how powerful or weak its gona be

[panchoman]

sounds like its intel getting back at nvidia for not licensing sli for intel chipsets or they want to pay each other for licenses so that nvidia can sli with nehalem and intel chipsets can do sli..

[eidairaman1]

sounds like its intel getting back at nvidia for not licensing sli for intel chipsets or they want to pay each other for licenses so that nvidia can sli with nehalem and intel chipsets can do sli..

its the fact that Nvidia requires a proprietary MCP where ATi Doesnt, thus making Crossfire Easier To implement on any chipset, just with the dual graphics battle, its politics running the show, nvidia doesnt want to run crossfire and ati doesnt want to run SLI, HP however has bypassed the Politics of both ATi and Nvidia, now if we could get a driver from a Blackbird 2.0.

[panchoman]

all intel chipsets have the ability to run sli and crossfire. sli and crossfire is just the use of specialized instruction sets for each thing respectively, like sse, etc. the intel chipsets are capable or running both but are locked to only run crossfire instruction sets. however, people have hacked intel chipsets to run sli instructions for nvidia cards up to the 7 series through the use of hacked drivers. unfortunantly the 8 (and 9 for that matter) use a different and more complex instruction set.. one which hasn't been cracked yet.

[eidairaman1]

Explain why Intel Skulltrail requires Nvidia MCPs for SLI then?

[eidairaman1]

how can you say it sucks?
its tottaly a new concept never used before
even intel doest know how powerful or weak its gona be

how can you say that when they are the ones producing it.

[hayder.master]

NO SLI!! How about crossfire?


crossfire is work
but there is news about disable crossfire too .. right now it is work with these cpu's

[hayder.master]

at end i see the next generation of card's support sli or crossfire. now i think the hehalem cpu go down not card's
or intel must do somthing for itself or amd win a round

[TonyStark]

Wow this is gonna have a major impact on nvidia. They could go bankrupt as approximately 99% of PC owners are running Quad SLI.

:rolleyes:

[Morgoth]

i think more 30% quad sli

[btarunr]

We're getting it wrong:

Shortly put, Intel has stripped SLI support from the Nehalem Bloomfield-ready chipsets.

It means that the Intel chipset(s) that support Nehalem derivatives won't support SLI (just as the X48/X38/P35 of today don't). Eventually NVidia will come up with a Nehalem supportive NForce line.

[DanishDevil]

They'll just make an 890i or something...

This comes down to SLI having a hardware need, and Crossfire being purely software-driven. You can run Crossfire on an SLI chipset...

[btarunr]

They'll just make an 890i or something...

This comes down to SLI having a hardware need, and Crossfire being purely software-driven. You can run Crossfire on an SLI chipset...

They're both purely software driven. Modders back in the GeForce 7 series days successfully could run SLI on a Intel 975X though no success with 8 series but still goes on to show its purely a matter of drivers. The NForce 200 chips on an D5400XS are merely excess baggage to show the world that to use SLI, there should be a pinch of NForce lest with just the 5400B northbridge, if NVidia let Intel present the board with SLI, it would/could have fascinated soft-modders great deal......death of NForce. The only significant thing that's making people buy mid/high-end NForce chipset based boards is SLI.

[yogurt_21]

wow, so nvidia announces hybrid sli for amd cpu's exclusively and intel seems to be wanting only ati highend. no matter what comes out of this little spat between intel and nvidia, it seems AMD/ATI is reaping the benefits. If this keeps going amd may be out of debt sooner thyan anyone thought.

[Kursah]

This gives a good reason for NV to be the first to release Dual, Tri and Quad-Core based GPU's imo. The hardest part there would be fabbing and TDP/Wattage heat output, but if a single card from NV can compete at a price-point and performance-point in comparison to a CF/Spider setup on an Intel based setup, then NV as I see it could have an upper hand. Of course there's a lot of money and risk involved with a move like that.

I'm sure everything will work out in the end, but I would really like to see GPU's follow suit in muti-cores-per-die applications that CPU's have taken mainstream in the last couple years with great success. I would rather have a dual-core vid card than a dual-GPU vid card imo. I know I've mentioned this a few times before, but I think this could be a very positive move for both NV and ATI to look at for future gpu technologies.

:toast:

[btarunr]

wow, so nvidia announces hybrid sli for amd cpu's exclusively and intel seems to be wanting only ati highend. no matter what comes out of this little spat between intel and nvidia, it seems AMD/ATI is reaping the benefits. If this keeps going amd may be out of debt sooner thyan anyone thought.

I agree, The best quad-core for under $250 still is X4 9850BE. The X3 Toliman CPU's seem to be competing hard with Wolfdale.

[hat]

So this changes nothing then? Nvidia will just keep making SLI chipsets.
My SLI chipset works fine for me except incompatibility with Speedfan and Sniper Elite.
Speedfan sucks but it's kind of sad to see Sniper Elite go.

[philbrown23]

Man there are alot of nvidia fanbueys in this thread! this is intels Smart F&^CK you to nvidia. Nvidia fired and intel fired back with a now your screwed! good, there cards are crap anyway.

[btarunr]

Man there are alot of nvidia fanbueys in this thread! this is intels Smart F&^CK you to nvidia. Nvidia fired and intel fired back with a now your screwed! good, there cards are crap anyway.

Right, read again:

We're getting it wrong:

Shortly put, Intel has stripped SLI support from the Nehalem Bloomfield-ready chipsets.

It means that the Intel chipset(s) that support Nehalem derivatives won't support SLI (just as the X48/X38/P35 of today don't). Eventually NVidia will come up with a Nehalem supportive NForce line.


So, Intel didn't backfire anything really, it's just that Intel chipsets won't support SLI (which they anyway don't). So no big deal really.

[hayder.master]

sometimes i think in worst! this move maybe expect from amd cuz it is support ati but what if this happend i mean amd become don't support sli too (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

[hayder.master]

now as i see today anthor war between intel and nvidia show in tomshardware
this make as sure the war is truth and become

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-nvidia-larrabee,5292.html

[yogurt_21]

So this changes nothing then? Nvidia will just keep making SLI chipsets.
My SLI chipset works fine for me except incompatibility with Speedfan and Sniper Elite.
Speedfan sucks but it's kind of sad to see Sniper Elite go.

That's correct if you're an intel/nvidia rig runner you'll be able to do the same thing you're doing now in the future.

If anythign this article simply affirms that intel highend chipsets will support crossfire while nvidia highend chipsets will support sli just like it is now.

[D4S4]

Explain why Intel Skulltrail requires Nvidia MCPs for SLI then?

Because nVidia has to make some money on Skulltrail. Those chips are useless and just adding latency.

[niko084]

This could be a stand by Intel to keep AMD in the running, by limiting Nvidia's power over ATI....

And yes believe it or not it would be a bad thing if AMD went out of business even for Intel...

[DanishDevil]

A bad thing for us. They would control the market and jack up prices. That would lead to a monopoly and government intervention.

[niko084]

A bad thing for us. They would control the market and jack up prices. That would lead to a monopoly and government intervention.

It would be bad for Intel as well.... As it would be bad for nvidia for ati to go out of business and vice versa.

[newconroer]

I think this will come back to Intel as a bumerang.
AMD-ATI will dominate the gaming market.

The best Intel can do is going together with nVidia agains AMD-ATI.
Maybe nVidia should go with Motorola for the next gaming PC ? this will leave Intel alone in the hot desert.

If this Larrabee thing comes to pass, everyone BUT Intel will be screwed; then again they may have a monopoly, but developers are going to go ******* hog wild with ideas for applications.

[hayder.master]

i think the only one hurt in this battel is intel , intel begin the fihgt with amd by decreasing the price maybe it is work but now intel chose a hard enemy now

[Wile E]

People seem to be misunderstanding. The chipset won't support SLI. nVidia can still make their own SLI chipset for Nehalem. The only Intel board that ever supported SLI is Skulltrail, and nVidia wouldn't give that to them unless they put the nVidia chip on the board. Absolutely nothing has changed here.

[laszlo]

People seem to be misunderstanding. The chipset won't support SLI. nVidia can still make their own SLI chipset for Nehalem. The only Intel board that ever supported SLI is Skulltrail, and nVidia wouldn't give that to them unless they put the nVidia chip on the board. Absolutely nothing has changed here.

i don't understand your point;the northbridge will be in the cpu so intel has the power to cut and limit the oc;sli so nvidia boards will have 2 northbrigde to bypass the restriction? that cost a lot

is easier for nv to make a good x2 card from the future series and who need more graphic power will have a choice

[Wile E]

i don't understand your point;the northbridge will be in the cpu so intel has the power to cut and limit the oc;sli so nvidia boards will have 2 northbrigde to bypass the restriction? that cost a lot

is easier for nv to make a good x2 card from the future series and who need more graphic power will have a choice
AMD's memory controller is on the chip as well, but SLI isn't a problem there. The boards will still need a NB to communicate with the PCI and PCIe lanes, even on Intel's own boards. SLI will not be a problem for nVidia.

[Morgoth]

i agree with Wile E ppl here thinking wrong abouth it
i got some chards


SLI on Bloomfield:

To understand the technology involved and what NVIDIA would need to develop in terms of chipset technology, let's first look at the Intel reference design utilizing a Bloomfield CPU (socket LGA1366) and Tylersburg I/O Hub (IOH).

http://bp1.blogger.com/_kttUtY0Z_zw/SB-SlCXwPjI/AAAAAAAAAVc/CKTqu2GG7EU/s1600/bloomfield-tylersburg.gif
http://bp3.blogger.com/_kttUtY0Z_zw/SB-S3iXwPkI/AAAAAAAAAVk/h7dd4_vqAJA/s1600/bloomfield-nforce.gif

As you can see in the above diagram, Bloomfield incorporates a single QuickPath interconnect link between the CPU and the IOH. For NVIDIA to offer a chipset alternative that would support SLI, they would simply need to develop a North Bridge chip with a QuickPath interface as shown in the following diagram. The rest of the IOH, namely the PCIe lanes and the HT link to their South Bridge is "off-the-shelf" for NVIDIA. Even the QuickPath interface is not a complex undertaking, thus making the license the key factor in whether such a product will ever see the light of day.

SLI on Lynnfield:

The situation is somewhat different with Lynnfield, Nehalem's variant targeted at the mainstream desktop market on socket LGA1160. Looking at the reference design as shown below, we note that the Lynnfield CPU has PCIe lanes on-die.

http://bp1.blogger.com/_kttUtY0Z_zw/SB-S-CXwPlI/AAAAAAAAAVs/IcIaHJf2u14/s1600/lynnfield.gif
http://bp2.blogger.com/_kttUtY0Z_zw/SB-TESXwPmI/AAAAAAAAAV0/l37HH6NclMY/s1600/lynnfield-nf200.gif

In the case of Lynnfield, the obvious approach to minimize overlap is for NVIDIA to support SLI via their existing NF200 (or BR04) chip which is essentially a PCIe 1x16 to 2x16 switch. This is the same chip that is currently used on the 780i and SkullTrail platforms.

Impact on Overclocking:

One other sidebar to this story, is that if SLI is supported on Nehalem, NVIDIA's quirky chipset issues shouldn't affect Nehalem overclocking. While NF6 and NF7 Intel chipsets were plagued by quirks and poor quad-core overclocking compared to their Intel counterparts, this situation will not recurr on the Nehalem platform. With Nehalem, the memory controller is now on-die with the CPU and out of the chipset... thus removing NVIDIA completely from the CPU and memory overclocking equation and relegating their technology strictly to GPU and I/O management where it is best served as in the days of the NF4 chipset.

Closing Thoughts:

As you can see, SLI on Nehalem is technically very straight-forward. However, the politics of the situation are far more complex and may hurt all involved. Enthusiasts can only hope that Intel and NVIDIA can somehow come to terms on the subject of cross-licensing one way or the other.

Hopefully this article has provided some insights into the issues associated with SLI on Nehalem. More will definitely come to light in the weeks and months ahead as the launch date for Bloomfield draws closer. Stay tuned to Nehalem News for more information as it becomes available.

[yogurt_21]

This article says nothing that isn't already true now. too many people are reading too much into it