The 4870 "2D Low", GPU voltage/Memory clock rate Bios Thread

nafets · Aug 13, 2008

Hehe, you don't have to do that.

I am positive it isn't going anywhere this time...

EastCoasthandle · Aug 13, 2008

nafets said:
Hehe, you don't have to do that.

I am positive it isn't going anywhere this time...

glad to read that. It looks like you've added more information as well.

Fastmix · Aug 14, 2008

I could be wrong by somehow something is not right, if I try to mod my bios (the one posted) and lower the 2d voltage to 1.083 I get an error when I try to flash.

Are you sure that maybe 1.063 is the lower voltage for that bios and 1.083 just makes no difference.....Just a thought.

nafets · Aug 14, 2008

The functionality of 1.063v and 1.083v is the same. As I've shown towards the bottom of my post, both perform the same regarding power consumption, and you can feel secure in using either one in your custom bios.

I'm recommending using 1.083v now as the lowest 2D IDLE voltage based on my newer findings of the ATI OverDrive 5 VDDC voltage ranges of 1.083v to 1.263v, in 0.06v steps.

The previous 1.063v setting was based on initial information of a possible voltage range of 1.063v to 1.363v, in 0.1v steps.

Without a DMM, I can't be 100% certain of the exact voltage ranges, but I am certain that my newer recommended values are very close to the actual operating voltages.

If you look at the untouched Stock2.bin BIOS (the one you modified), the default 2D/3DLP voltage is 1.203v, which is part of the newer voltage range I discovered. This leads me to believe that 1.083v is is the proper lowest voltage for that BIOS.

(I seem to be saying the same thing over and over again!)

----------------------------------

To minimize errors when working with BIOS files, always start with the original BIOS file (.bin file), then add your custom settings. Starting with an already modified BIOS file (.rom file), and further modifying settings can lead to checksum errors when saving or errors when flashing.

Regarding BIOS flashing, I always use ATIFlash v3.60 in DOS for my HD4870. The normal command line used is;

"atiflash -p 0 XXXXX.rom"

If there is an error, I usually force the flash using this command line;

"atiflash -p -f 0 XXXXXX.rom"

This functionality is the same if using ATIWinFlash v2.0.1.2 in WINDOWS, except to use the forced flash command line, you will need to run the program from the Command Prompt.

LuxZg · Aug 14, 2008

Hey nafets! Nice to see you (and your post

) back

Seems like you've saved me a lot of re-testing

Also, nice to have that additional info, you've really tried it all as it seems.. Tnx!

(running to the phone to check when are my thermometer & power-meter coming! rest is here

)

Fastmix · Aug 14, 2008

Best 4870 All in one bios remodded to lowest 1.083

Here is a copy of the new remodded bios if anyone is interested, 2d clock is 550/900/1.083, 3d @ stock 750/900/1.263 and offcourse it includes the Asus Top fan profile.

I just want to add...that this bios is excellent for overclocking, my first test using amd gpu clock @ 830/1100 showed the card very stable and the fan kicking in when needed keeping the card cool 3d mark vantage gave me 8491 for the GPU on an old 939 x2 3800 @ 2.5, I am very pleased these cards have lots of head room for overclocking.

90 views and probably downloads, 0 thanks...that's a shame.

wolf · Aug 15, 2008

can thses modifications be made to the asus top bios, so i can have the great oc speed and increased CCC limits but also good 2d power useage.

also, im trying to think of a way around the damn memory clock switching bug, because as we've seen, the biggest power savings by far come from lowing the GDDR5 clock speed, not to mention the heat saving across the board.

LuxZg · Aug 15, 2008

@nafets
I see more new info in your post! I'll try out ATI Tray Tools ASAP

Will report back here about fan settings.. as I'm still on stock fan (dooh!)

Btw, could you please add a link to W1zzard's 4870 X2 article (this page) up there where you quote him, just as a reference. Thnx!

EDIT:
Tested Tray tools.. Few infos and questions.

First off - fan profiles work, thank you very much

I've copied ones from ASUS bios, with just a few tweaks at lower values, and it works so far.

Next, how did you get this:

nafets said:
Examples: In limited testing I've set two profiles;
2D - 160/225 @ 1.083v (For general desktop and internet use)
3D - 750/900 @ 1.263v (For gaming)

I can get no lower than 490/720. Could this be BIOS thing?
Also, my maximum for the memory oc in tray tools is pretty high, to be exact - 1125 core/1350 memory.
Meaning you have 0-1000 for both, and I have 490-1125 range for core, and 720-1350 for memory.

I also get few voltage values offered, but in neglible steps (using reference BIOS still) - 1,237/1,250/1,263/1,276

Last finding is that it's still a bit buggy, and unfriendly if you use both it and CCC for profiles. Ofcourse, you're rarely use both, but I've found out that somehow ATT locked me into 470MHz for core in 2D state, so I had to load/reload few different CCC profiles before it was back to default 500MHz (with ATT turned off few minutes before that).
But overall, looks good if you plan to use only ATT for everything.

Oh, and one more thing. Seems that with "automatic fan" in profile, I get fan speedups to 80+% here and there, even if temperature is low (for example, it should be 35% fan for 55C and 40% for 60C, but I get 84% all from nowhere when on let's say 58-59C; haven't noticed it always, just with some settings, and not with manual although I've used that one just for a minute or so; probably nothing big, it did that before fixing CCC on manual as well)

Fastmix · Aug 16, 2008

can thses modifications be made to the asus top bios, so i can have the great oc speed and increased CCC limits but also good 2d power useage.

Unfortunately the Asus top bios does not allow voltage changes but in future we might be able to add to this bios the CCC limits of the Asus top hopefully with RBE 114.

wolf · Aug 16, 2008

Fastmix said:
Unfortunately the Asus top bios does not allow voltage changes but in future we might be able to add to this bios the CCC limits of the Asus top hopefully with RBE 114.

given your findings i had a suspicion it was only the newer bios which allowed voltage changes.

but :rockout:

to extending CCC limits.

also a problem i have had is when using a bios with a default OC (825/4000), CCC overclocking doesnt work at all. is this because i flashed clocks higher than a stock bios can oc to in CCC?

Fastmix · Aug 16, 2008

obviously you have already maxed out your CCC limit, but you can use other tools like the amd gpu clock tool to overclock further.

FR@NK · Aug 16, 2008

nafets said:
I used the Stock2.bin BIOS and altered the GPU/MEMORY clocks to 375/450. After a whole lot of BIOS flashing here's what I came up with;

Code:

BIOS set VOLTAGE | Power Consumption | Gpu-Z VDDC Current 1.063 (-0.2v) 104W 12.2A [b]1.083 (-0.18v) 104W 12.2A[/b] [b]1.143 (-0.12v) 108W 13.5A[/b] 1.163 (-0.1v) 110W 14.9A [b]1.203 (-0.06v) 110W 14.9A[/b] 1.217 (-0.46v) 114W 14.9A [b]1.263 (Default) 114W 14.9A[/b] 1.323 (+0.06) 104W 12.2A 1.363 (+0.1v) 104W 12.2A

I'm not sure why the Amps is the same for 1.263v and 1.203v. It could be an error in what is reported to Gpu-Z or something that I'm unaware of. I retested those values a few times and got the same result. Interesting.

Could you test these at higher clocks to see if there more of a difference in amperage between 1.263 and 1.203?

Fastmix · Aug 16, 2008

You were right Nafets as per Ati tray tool the voltage on the 4870 is 1.083, 1.143,1.203 and 1.263 at least with the 105 bios that I am using.

nafets · Aug 16, 2008

LuxZg said:
...Btw, could you please add a link to W1zzard's 4870 X2 article (this page) up there where you quote him, just as a reference. Thnx!

Done.

LuxZg said:
...I can get no lower than 490/720. Could this be BIOS thing?
Also, my maximum for the memory oc in tray tools is pretty high, to be exact - 1125 core/1350 memory.
Meaning you have 0-1000 for both, and I have 490-1125 range for core, and 720-1350 for memory.

I also get few voltage values offered, but in neglible steps (using reference BIOS still) - 1,237/1,250/1,263/1,276

You are using a Stock1.bin BIOS variant, which does not allow modified voltages in the BIOS, and had a very small (yet useless) voltage range, which you listed. I did run ATT with the Stock1.bin BIOS and real-time voltage changing was non-responsive (IE.....it ran at 1.263v no matter what). So basically if you can't modify the voltages in the BIOS, then you can't change them with ATT.

Solution? Just flash your HD4870 with the updated Stock2.bin BIOS or modify your Stock1.bin BIOS variant with Radeon Bios Editor v1.13 using the Additional Features -> One-click update 4xx0-BIOS settings (113-B50701-RBE + Also decrease voltages). Using either of these BIOSes will unlock the real-time voltage changing functionality. If you're using an Asus BIOS you may not be able to do this. I don't have any experience with using any Asus HD4870 BIOSes, so your mileage may vary, regarding voltages.

Regarding the overclocking ranges in ATT, I have updated my post under the "Updates - Regarding *Ati Tray Tools Beta v1.5.8.1250* - Overclocking GPU/MEM" section. Check it out for the fix..

LuxZg said:
Last finding is that it's still a bit buggy, and unfriendly if you use both it and CCC for profiles. Ofcourse, you're rarely use both, but I've found out that somehow ATT locked me into 470MHz for core in 2D state, so I had to load/reload few different CCC profiles before it was back to default 500MHz (with ATT turned off few minutes before that).
But overall, looks good if you plan to use only ATT for everything.

If you have conflicts in the future with CCC and ATT, just reboot the computer. As long as you don't have ATT loading up during startup via the Registry or the Startup folder, then CCC and it's profiles should take precedent. ATT and it's profiles are only active when the actual program is running. The only exception is any graphical settings (Vsync, AA/AF, texture/mipmap quality, etc...) you set with ATT, as these are modifications of registry keys, and will always be permanent, even when ATT is not running. But much of this is only educated assumptions, as I do not nor have used CCC with my HD4870.

LuxZg said:
Oh, and one more thing. Seems that with "automatic fan" in profile, I get fan speedups to 80+% here and there, even if temperature is low (for example, it should be 35% fan for 55C and 40% for 60C, but I get 84% all from nowhere when on let's say 58-59C; haven't noticed it always, just with some settings, and not with manual although I've used that one just for a minute or so; probably nothing big, it did that before fixing CCC on manual as well)

That is quite odd. The one thing that stuck out to me is your 84% fan cycle value. This is actually the default "Spin Up Cycle %" value in Stock1.bin and Stock2.bin BIOSes. An explanation of what this is follows:

As quoted from Unwinder (Maker of Rivatuner) "Spinup cycle (0 – 100 %) – defines fan duty cycle for fan engine spinup period. Spinup period is required because due to fan engine nature it is impossible to start it on any desired duty cycle. Minimum fan duty cycle allowing the engine to start is called spinup duty cycle. Fan controller always performs fan spinup cycle when it is being started (e.g. when leaving passive mode in automatic fan speed control mode)."

It seems that something is causing the fan to go into "Spinup cycle" mode. You could try editing your BIOS with a lower Spinup cycle %, something that isn't as noisy, so that if it happens again, you just won't notice it. You can also try lowering the Spin up time, which is usually set to 4. As before with CCC, I'm only making educated guesses, as I'm using aftermarket cooling, and I have no experience with the BIOSes fan controls or settings. I was just browsing through the Ati Tray Tools Beta Forums over at Guru3D, and there is another user there with the same 84% spinup cycle problem that you are experiencing. This seems to be more than an isolated incident. Interesting...

FR@NK]Could you test these at higher clocks to see if there more of a difference in amperage between 1.263 and 1.203?[/QUOTE] Done. Results have been added to the "Updates - Regarding *VOLTAGE testing*" section. [QUOTE=Fastmix said:
You were right Nafets as per Ati tray tool the voltage on the 4870 is 1.083, 1.143,1.203 and 1.263 at least with the 105 bios that I am using.

Awesome! I'm glad to see that it's working for you. Things are really coming along great for the HD4870 and HD4800 series in general. Real-time voltage changing is such a treat, considering all the lousy BIOS flashing I went through, during testing.

VuurVOS · Aug 16, 2008

Cool and quiet ^^.

LuxZg · Aug 16, 2008

nafets said:
You are using a Stock1.bin BIOS variant, which does not allow modified voltages in the BIOS, <cut>

I knew that, just wanted to say how it's shown in ATT with stock bios

Regarding the overclocking ranges in ATT, I have updated my post under the "Updates - Regarding *Ati Tray Tools Beta v1.5.8.1250* - Overclocking GPU/MEM" section. Check it out for the fix..

Thanks man

Haven't used ATT before, so I didn't know where to look, I was even looking for .ini files or something with profiles settings :laugh:

Running on 160/250 right now, 9.5A (since voltage is still on stock), and I'm pretty satisfied

nafets - you've been the light shat showed us the way :respect:

That is quite odd. The one thing that stuck out to me is your 84% fan cycle value. This is actually the default "Spin Up Cycle %" value in Stock1.bin and Stock2.bin BIOSes. An explanation <cut> I was just browsing through the Ati Tray Tools Beta Forums over at Guru3D, and there is another user there with the same 84% spinup cycle problem that you are experiencing. This seems to be more than an isolated incident. Interesting...

Hmmm.. I'll have a look at it. I wasn't going to use ATT for longer time because of that low-clock limit, but now that you've solved that for me, I'll see what can be done to stop this from happening. I'll be going to Accelero soon, but we should solve it anyway

EDIT: Just happened again on 160/250 clocks and 46/47C GPU temps, nothing was changing for a good 10 minutes in GPUZ sensor tab, so it's really weird.. I've just remembered that new RBE 1.13 "corrects a well known "spin-up bug" according to changelog. I'll try it when doing low-voltage tweak, since it's connected in RBE anyway..

VuurVOS said:
>7,5A image<
Cool and quiet ^^.

Congrats

And you deserve a couple more beers for that low-voltage BIOS you've provided to our little community :toast:

EDIT (17.8.2008): been playing with ATT beta all day today, and it's a great tool, really. Haven't even expirienced spin-ups like before, since someone mentioned it only happens with GPU-Z running maybe that's why. Maybe cos I've set up fan table differently, not sure.. But everything works "as advertised". I have two profiles, one on low-2d clocks and silent fans, other for 3D with overclock 790/1100 and higher fans (but still on auto in both profiles), profiles auto-switch themselves on/off whenever I go to 2d/3d and back, I get OSD monitoring of FPS and GPU clocks/temps/fans, I get monitoring & logging of most of things (just lacking VRM data which GPU-Z has, and if it had all three CPU temps it would be awsome

).. All in all, almost no complaints (just those few sensors

). I've also had confirmation that my stock BIOS (Club3D) works with low-volt RBE tweak, so hopefully in a day or two I'll have both data with several combos of stock&moded BIOS, and stock&aftermarket cooling. But so far, works like a charm

If it wasn't for 3D-high-fan-noise I would almost skip on mounting Accelero S1 on this card

boba23 · Aug 17, 2008

hey folks,

first of all thx for your findings regarding voltage adjustments. Been looking for some method to lower my 4870 desktop voltage and speeds.
Using stock2 bios I can set voltage to 1.083 and gpu/mem to 160/225 in ATT just fine. One thing that confuses me though is, that GPU-Z 0.2.7 keeps showing 1.263 volts as voltage. Is this normal, or should gpuz show me 1.083?
are there any other tools that read gpu voltage correctly?

boba

nafets · Aug 18, 2008

Gpu-Z is reading the stock voltage value given by the drivers, which is 1.263v. Since this value never changes, you'll always see 1.2625v in Gpu-Z, regardless of your actual HD4870 voltages. This is normal.

If you have an AMD motherboard, AMD Overdrive software can detect your actual voltage. Everest Beta might also list it too. I'm not sure though...

Fastmix · Aug 18, 2008

Att training needed

I figure it out how to use Att and auto the switch 2d/3d.

Can someone tell why when I use Att sometimes, Gpuz or Everest do not show the Vrm.

Thanks.

nafets · Aug 18, 2008

I have the same problem Fastmix, with the VRM monitoring disappearing from Gpu-Z. This happens when I modify GPU/MEM clock rates with AGCT and sometimes with ATT.

I'm guessing that AGCT and ATT are interfering with Gpu-Z's/Everest's polling of the HD4870's VRMs.

Haven't been able to find a way around it though.... :/

Fastmix · Aug 18, 2008

Do you think it could be a driver issue?

nafets · Aug 18, 2008

If it's anything in the ATI drivers, it's not something we can change. This happens regardless of driver version, for me anyways. Tested with 8.8 Beta, 8.7 Final, 8.6 Final in WinXP Pro SP2...

LuxZg · Aug 18, 2008

I have used ATT whole day yesterday, both with GPUZ and Everest,and haven't noticed it. 8.7 official drivers under XP 32bit SP3. Since GPUZ version 0.2.7 I have had no trouble.. I use Everest less frequently since GPUZ gives me more info, so maybe I could have missed it somehow.

Could you both post your OS/drivers?

nafets · Aug 18, 2008

It's more prevalent, and always happens with AGCT.

With ATT I only encountered the problem twice, but I wasn't paying attention to what I did. Haven't been able to replicate it...

EastCoasthandle · Aug 18, 2008

Great info so far :toast:

However, have we come to a consensus of what beta bios people can use that offers:
1.083 GPUv Idle
1.263 GPUv Load
2D memory clock rate without any flickering
etc

That is so far stable??

System Name	MY PC
Processor	E8400 @ 3.80Ghz > Q9650 3.60Ghz
Motherboard	Maximus Formula
Cooling	D5, 7/16" ID Tubing, Maze4 with Fuzion CPU WB
Memory	XMS 8500C5D @ 1066MHz
Video Card(s)	HD 2900 XT 858/900 to 4870 to 5870 (Keep Vreg area clean)
Storage	2
Display(s)	24"
Case	P180
Audio Device(s)	X-fi Plantinum
Power Supply	Silencer 750
Software	XP Pro SP3 to Windows 7
Benchmark Scores	This varies from one driver to another.

System Name	My main PC - C2D
Processor	Intel Core 2 Duo E4400 @ 320x10 (3200MHz) w/ Scythe Ninja rev.B + 120mm fan
Motherboard	Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3R (Intel P35 + ICH9R chipset, socket 775)
Cooling	Scythe Ninja rev.B + 120mm fan \| 250mm case fan on side \| 120mm PSU fan
Memory	4x 1GB Kingmax MARS DDR2 800 CL5
Video Card(s)	Sapphire ATi Radeon HD4890
Storage	Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 250GB SATAII, 16MB cache, 7200 rpm
Display(s)	Samsung SyncMaster 757DFX, 17“ CRT, max: 1920x1440 @64Hz
Case	Aplus CS-188AF case with 250mm side fan
Audio Device(s)	Realtek ALC889A onboard 7.1, with Logitech X-540 5.1 speakers
Power Supply	Chieftec 450W (GPS450AA-101A) /w 120mm fan
Software	Windows XP Professional SP3 32bit / Windows 7 Beta1 64bit (dual boot)
Benchmark Scores	none

System Name	MightyX
Processor	Ryzen 5800X3D
Motherboard	Gigabyte X570 I Aorus Pro WiFi
Cooling	Scythe Fuma 2
Memory	32GB DDR4 3600 CL16
Video Card(s)	Asus TUF RTX3080 Deshrouded
Storage	WD Black SN850X 2TB
Display(s)	LG 42C2 4K OLED
Case	Coolermaster NR200P
Audio Device(s)	LG SN5Y / Focal Clear
Power Supply	Corsair SF750 Platinum
Mouse	Corsair Dark Core RBG Pro SE
Keyboard	Glorious GMMK Compact w/pudding
VR HMD	Meta Quest 3
Software	case populated with Artic P12's
Benchmark Scores	4k120 OLED Gsync bliss

System Name	My main PC - C2D
Processor	Intel Core 2 Duo E4400 @ 320x10 (3200MHz) w/ Scythe Ninja rev.B + 120mm fan
Motherboard	Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3R (Intel P35 + ICH9R chipset, socket 775)
Cooling	Scythe Ninja rev.B + 120mm fan \| 250mm case fan on side \| 120mm PSU fan
Memory	4x 1GB Kingmax MARS DDR2 800 CL5
Video Card(s)	Sapphire ATi Radeon HD4890
Storage	Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 250GB SATAII, 16MB cache, 7200 rpm
Display(s)	Samsung SyncMaster 757DFX, 17“ CRT, max: 1920x1440 @64Hz
Case	Aplus CS-188AF case with 250mm side fan
Audio Device(s)	Realtek ALC889A onboard 7.1, with Logitech X-540 5.1 speakers
Power Supply	Chieftec 450W (GPS450AA-101A) /w 120mm fan
Software	Windows XP Professional SP3 32bit / Windows 7 Beta1 64bit (dual boot)
Benchmark Scores	none

System Name	MightyX
Processor	Ryzen 5800X3D
Motherboard	Gigabyte X570 I Aorus Pro WiFi
Cooling	Scythe Fuma 2
Memory	32GB DDR4 3600 CL16
Video Card(s)	Asus TUF RTX3080 Deshrouded
Storage	WD Black SN850X 2TB
Display(s)	LG 42C2 4K OLED
Case	Coolermaster NR200P
Audio Device(s)	LG SN5Y / Focal Clear
Power Supply	Corsair SF750 Platinum
Mouse	Corsair Dark Core RBG Pro SE
Keyboard	Glorious GMMK Compact w/pudding
VR HMD	Meta Quest 3
Software	case populated with Artic P12's
Benchmark Scores	4k120 OLED Gsync bliss

Processor	7900
Motherboard	Rampage Apex
Cooling	H115i
Memory	64GB TridentZ 3200 14-14-14-34-1T
Video Card(s)	Fury X
Case	Corsair 740
Audio Device(s)	8ch LPCM via HDMI to Yamaha Z7 Receiver
Power Supply	Corsair AX860
Mouse	G903
Keyboard	G810
Software	8.1 x64

System Name	Ryzen5900X
Processor	AMD Ryzen 5900X
Motherboard	Gigabyte B550 AORUS PRO AC
Cooling	NZXT Kraken X62
Memory	4x G.Skill F4-3600C17D-8GTZ
Video Card(s)	AMD Radeon RX 6800XT Midnight Black

The 4870 "2D Low", GPU voltage/Memory clock rate Bios Thread

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